Now I understand why at each windows 11 update, they introduce more bugs than ever
That’s why their products are so crappy!
Microsoft CEO says up to 30% of the company's code was written by AI | TechCrunch
Submitted 11 months ago by Wispy2891@lemmy.world to technology@lemmy.world
Comments
Lanske@lemmy.world 11 months ago
Coreidan@lemmy.world 11 months ago
What? There products have long been shit ever before AI was even a thing.
Anyone remember windows ME? I sure as fuck do.
phantomwise@lemmy.ml 11 months ago
No way, they get their results through honest effort. Anyone can make crappy AI products now, but Microsoft have been doing crappy products the hard way for decades. Don’t downplay their hard work !
sunglocto@lemmy.dbzer0.com 11 months ago
Not suprised
Reygle@lemmy.world 11 months ago
They’re attempting to make excuses for their inability to create functional software
megopie@lemmy.blahaj.zone 11 months ago
They’re lying about using AI to write software, they probably have required all their programmers to have an AI plugin installed, and are thus counting any code they make as “written by AI”, and then are counting any minor edit to existing code as the entire thing being “written by AI”.
The software is bad because it’s written to serve the infinite growth imperative. The reason they claim they’re writing code with AI is because that being true is the only hope that they have for achieving the infinite growth imperative. It’s a con, it’s a cult, they are extracting as much value as they can before everything falls apart.
drmoose@lemmy.world 11 months ago
They include tab complete of github copilot which is often as much as a single dot. Same thing they’ve done with all github copilot stats.
sqibkw@lemmy.world 11 months ago
Windows hate train looks fun, but as someone who works in the industry, most of that code is probably just unit tests and boilerplate stuff.
Copilot is decent at quickly writing huge amounts of tedious unit test code, requiring minimal tweaks. And since Microsoft works with languages like C# and .NET for their native apps, and likely backend too, there is quite a bit of verbosity that Copilot can take care of.
No real code is AI-generated. He’s just saying shit like this to keep idiot investors happy.
10001110101@lemm.ee 11 months ago
I’d guess it’s mostly the AI autocomplete stuff. I.e. you keep on typing until the AI guesses it right then press tab to save keystrokes. LLMs are really bad at making test cases in my experience; they, ironically, can’t do the simple but nuanced computations needed to figure out what the output should be given the inputs, or to recognize and test the edge cases.
sqibkw@lemmy.world 11 months ago
Oh yeah it can’t do anything complicated, only on simple modules. And I usually give it pretty detailed instructions on my expected I/O. It just converts a few sentences of English to dozens of lines of code.
MCasq_qsaCJ_234@lemmy.zip 11 months ago
Thanks for the context
alecbowles@lemm.ee 11 months ago
Isn’t that the problem tho. He’s the CEO of Microsoft which is supposed to be a bight end technology firm saying bullshit
MCasq_qsaCJ_234@lemmy.zip 11 months ago
Operations are one thing, but investors are another. The latter don’t know the sector, but they want profits.
So you have to convince them not to interfere with your activities, because they can make things worse.
Steamymoomilk@sh.itjust.works 11 months ago
If this were true there would massive databreaches. AI is really bad at keeping private keys private. Not to even mention the default credentials it would use because it doesnt have commen sense to change them
ZILtoid1991@lemmy.world 11 months ago
Likely a lot of manpower were focused on that, and/or the employees rather wrote their own code then lied about the AI use (heard a lot about it).
PresidentCamacho@lemm.ee 11 months ago
I disagree. It feels like your making this assumption from the point of view that people using AI to develop turn their whole brain off and let AI take the wheel. Any dev I know using AI uses it as a time saving measure, i.e. advanced autocomplete, or to assist with troubleshooting as a form of advanced search engine. Also you would have no need to give the AI the actual key itself, at most you would give it the title of the variable the key is saved as. Also major companies tend to have fail safes in place in their pipelines checking to see if private codes are ever made public and then they just change the code.
ripcord@lemmy.world 11 months ago
I find it hard to believe because I work at an adjacent company who has made similar claims and it is complete bullshit.
I do think there is some about of “AI provided a smart complete and the developer hit ‘tab’ to take the changes” equalling “this code was written by AI” in some metrics that go to the execs. And since the execs mandated high AI use everyone is fine just saying they have high AI use regardless of how true it is.
whotookkarl@lemmy.world 11 months ago
Code written by software doesn’t mean AI unless you ignore compilers
Executives lie to boost profits and justify their decisions, I doubt MS execs even know how much of their code is AI generated just like the ad sales company exec they were talking to in the article
aesthelete@lemmy.world 11 months ago
It shows
nectar45@lemmy.zip 11 months ago
That explains so much
M0oP0o@mander.xyz 11 months ago
andallthat@lemmy.world 11 months ago
Fun fact: Nadella has been replaced with an AI agent a couple of months ago and still nobody has noticed. “Copilot, while I’m away, generate bs on AI adoption and fire a bunch of employees, ok?”
GooberEar@lemmy.wtf 11 months ago
This makes sense and would explain the mainline windows versioning and probably the xbox versioning too!
Microsoft to AI: List all the integers from one to eleven.
AI: 3. 95. 98. 2000. XP. Vista. 7. 8. 10. 11.
Mio@feddit.nu 11 months ago
And how many times was all that code rewritten?
phoenixz@lemmy.ca 11 months ago
I’m still forced to use Microsoft Outlook and teams, unfortunately, and boy oh boy is it bad.
Yesterday i spent 45 minutes of a 1,5 meeting (that would have been 45 minutes) on trying teams to please try and use the right microphone, please share a screen (not working under Firefox or chrome now, apparently)
I can’t wait for the day that I have some time to get us off that dog shit
Blackmist@feddit.uk 11 months ago
I love that Outlook occasionally fires up one of its keyboard shortcuts and clears your entire email you were typing if you’re not paying attention.
Fucking love it.
phoenixz@lemmy.ca 11 months ago
Yeah WTF is that about? Office picks up on my keys at least once or twice a day, I don’t have that issue with any other program. Just another day in Microsoft land, and it suuuuuucks
shalafi@lemmy.world 11 months ago
Outlook is pretty damned bullet proof, Teams, OTOH, is a fucking mess. I can see IT wanting to keep everything in the same ecosystem, that’s perfectly sane, but I’m certain Zoom can be setup to honor AD credentials. We set it to use Google SSO.
phoenixz@lemmy.ca 11 months ago
Outlook…
Ok
Pretty solid
Bahaha hahahahaha
Sorry.
Outlook is a lot of things. “Gooey crap” would be one way to describe it, but “solid”? Yeah, no. Gmail is (well, was) pretty solid. There are a lot of other webmail providers out there, including self hosted options and most are pretty solid, yeah. Outlook, though? It’s a shit show, it’s annoying.
Do you love me? Please love me, please give feedback, please give feedback again, please look at this, hey am I the best? Am I…
STFU YOU PIECE OF CRAP! Can you PLEASE just let me do my email without being an attention whore every hour?
Even down to the basics. Back button? “What is that? Never heard of it, can’t go back to the message I just was on because I’m Microsoft software and so half baked.”
Having two tabs open? “Oh noes, now I get scawed, now I don’t know how to manage sessions anymore, better just sign you out everywhere.” What is it with Microsoft and not being able to do something basic as sessions normal? I’m not even asking for good, definitely not “awesome”, just normal, and that is already too much to ask.
Try running it in Firefox! I’m sure it’s totally not on purpose, just “oopsie woopsie poopsie” accidentally bwoken. Maybe it’s working again today, who knows, tomorrow it’ll be broken again. I run everything on Firefox except the Microsoft sites, they have to be in chrome because fuck you, that’s why.
Seriously, I can’t take any Microsoft software seriously at this point, and all of it is on its way out in our company, I’m making sure of that
andallthat@lemmy.world 11 months ago
jabeez@lemmy.today 11 months ago
Ha, yeah my Outlook will randomly just not be able to connect to server when starting up. This is from fresh boot every day, some days it just can’t, have to reboot and then it works! Fucking brilliant, they managed to break email.
Lemminary@lemmy.world 11 months ago
not working under Firefox
Weird
or chrome
Oh, there it is
Feature exclusive, huh!
gerryflap@feddit.nl 11 months ago
Yeah that’d explain some stuff. Happy to have switched to Linux
lka1988@lemmy.dbzer0.com 11 months ago
Same. My games even run faster.
daddycool@lemmy.world 11 months ago
Well, that explains Windows 11.
Zink@programming.dev 11 months ago
Eww. Maybe it’s not really true and Microsoft just wants to remind us that big corporate AI is so legit that all the software you use all day was “helped” by it.
But really for me the issue is the company, not the AI. If I read an article about AI generated code making it into the Linux kernel or some gnu/kde/etc utilities, I don’t think I would worry much because those changes will be reviewed by cranky old nerds who care about the functionality of the software first. I have no such confidence in Microsoft’s processes.
ExtantHuman@lemm.ee 11 months ago
This only makes sense if they are counting intellisense auto complete as “AI written”
purplemonkeymad@programming.dev 11 months ago
Was the auto complete in visual studio not a “trained” set before the llm craze kicked off? Would not surprise me if they decided to include that.
shalafi@lemmy.world 11 months ago
Has to be something like that. Nadella is somehow cheating with the number, trying to keep the AI hype going.
You could say ALL of my latest scripts were written with AI. Because I often use it to get a hint or gather some boilerplate code (which I still go over and modify).
Pirata@lemm.ee 11 months ago
So this explains why Microsoft Swiftkey is total dogshit now. Also why the Outlook barely works.
Its unbelievable.
Lemminary@lemmy.world 11 months ago
I used to be able to swipe freely on SwiftKey, and now I can’t really do it without being extra careful and mindful of not spelling the wrong thing. Idk what Microsoft did to the product but I wouldn’t call it an improvement.
Pirata@lemm.ee 11 months ago
Idk what Microsoft did to the product but I wouldn’t call it an improvement.
I think the article we’re looking at here isn’t really hyperbolic. They got AI to write all their code and broke the Keyboard.
Just FYI, if you can live without swipping, I recommend FUTO keyboard., it is basically Swiftkey but it actually works and doesn’t come with Microsoft’s spyware built in.
It’s what I use now, and I’m really happy. Don’t be fooled by it being in Alpha, because it works flawlessly.
kate@lemmy.uhhoh.com 11 months ago
??? No it’s not! Can investors sue because this is such an obvious lie? Pls I have 0.3 Microsoft shares
kate@lemmy.uhhoh.com 11 months ago
Are they including code generated to test their own models capability maybe?
IcyToes@sh.itjust.works 11 months ago
He used the word written by software. This is ambiguous and doesn’t mean AI, for example, using annotations for variables and generating the getters and setters would count. Right click and create function body for interface function definitions also.
They’re exaggerating to pretend their AI is more useful than it is.
PlexSheep@infosec.pub 11 months ago
Don’t forget code generation for stuff like bindings or database schemes
jaybone@lemmy.zip 11 months ago
People have been using annotations to generate code since I rode my dinosaur to work.
MoonRaven@feddit.nl 11 months ago
Intellisense in visual studio has also been really good for over a decade. Which is technically also written by software and not me.
Serinus@lemmy.world 11 months ago
I mean, really good intellisense is a great improvement, but it’s not replacing devs any time soon.
superkret@feddit.org 11 months ago
Honestly, I’m not surprised.
ddash@lemmy.dbzer0.com 11 months ago
“Up to” can also be 0%. Why is there even a need to say “up to” here.
taladar@sh.itjust.works 11 months ago
So you are saying up to 100% of their code is written by AI?
superkret@feddit.org 11 months ago
Up to 100% of all Windows code was written by a Macaque monkey on meth.
FergleFFergleson@infosec.pub 11 months ago
Well, that would explain a lot.
I’m also guessing that at “up to 30%” of the company’s leadership decisions are being made by AI too.
megopie@lemmy.blahaj.zone 11 months ago
I bet they’re counting code written while someone had an AI plugin installed as “written by AI” and I bet that accounts for almost all of that 30%. On top of that, I’m betting that they made it mandatory to have such a plug in, and the other 70% is just code written before they mandated this.
taladar@sh.itjust.works 11 months ago
I would be very surprised if 30% of their code lines had even been touched at all by anyone since AI coding assistants became a thing.
tal@lemmy.today 11 months ago
megopie@lemmy.blahaj.zone 11 months ago
I could see stuff getting small changes and them claiming that the entirety of the new version is “written by AI”.
SandmanXC@lemmy.world 11 months ago
Also, having 1/3 lines with obvious code that can be auto suggested correctly would make sense, but that is hardly code “written by ai” in the way they suggest.
Nighed@feddit.uk 11 months ago
Those are the easy time savings though, the safe easy stuff the developer doesn’t have to worry about anymore. (Giving them time do the gnarly stuff)
megopie@lemmy.blahaj.zone 11 months ago
I’d guess a lot of the people writing the code don’t even have it turned on, it’s just installed because management said it had to be, because management wants to be able to tell investors they’re “innovating work flows”.
krimson@lemmy.world 11 months ago
Horseshit.
The current state of code generated by AI is sketchy at best. I often get plain wrong answers because the model tries to derive. It comes up with calls to functions and properties that just do not exist.
“You are right, I made a mistake. Here is a better answer.” Continues to give wrong answers.
Apart from that, apps that are glued together from AI generated code are not maintainable at all. What if there is a bug somewhere and you so not comprehend what is actually happening? Ask AI to fix it? Yeah good luck with that.
I do use AI for simple questions, and it works fairly well for that, but this claim by MS is just marketing bullshit.
nickwitha_k@lemmy.sdf.org 11 months ago
I do use AI for simple questions, and it works fairly well for that, but this claim by MS is just marketing bullshit.
This is my experience. It can be useful for simple things that used to be found with a web search before AI slop broke things. For example, I was having trouble getting a simple CGO program for a POC to communicate with the main Go process. This should have been solvable easily with documentation but the CGO docs are pretty bad and sample code was near impossible to find due to AI slop in the search results. GPT was able to provide the needed sample code to unblock me.
unwarlikeExtortion@lemmy.ml 11 months ago
“You are right, I made a mistake. Here is a better answer.” Continues to give wrong answers.
To be fair, the AI’s not wrong. It’s probably better, but just a teeny tiny bit so.
Hinestly, AI is like a genie - whatever you come up with he’ll just butcher and misinterpret so you start questioning both your own sanity and the semantics of language. Good thing these genies have no wish limit, but bad thing that they murder rainforests while generating their non-sequitur replies.
fmstrat@lemmy.nowsci.com 11 months ago
“Auto complete generated 30% of characters”
Fixed it.
spooky2092@lemmy.blahaj.zone 11 months ago
“You are right, I made a mistake. Here is a better answer.” Continues to give wrong answers
The exact same wrong answer. Co-Pilot is especially bad for that. I’m practically giving up using it outside of vs code because the actual copilot AI is dog shit stupid m
Nighed@feddit.uk 11 months ago
Would be interesting to see how they measured that metric. Are they tagging individual lines as AI generated?
What those lines are too would be interesting,AI as auto complete is less dangerous than complete generation, but probably also less dangerous.
tal@lemmy.today 11 months ago
I hope that that’s inclusive of something like lines of documentation.
Wispy2891@lemmy.world 11 months ago
Power move by the zucc by first asking how much genai is used at Microsoft then refusing to answer his own question at Facebook 😂
MeaanBeaan@lemmy.world 11 months ago
Everybody saying this is why their products are shit are really confusing me. It’s not like Microsoft just started being terrible. They’ve been terrible for a real long time. Way before AI was a thing. This is just a symptom of Microsoft’s awfulness not a reason for it.
megopie@lemmy.blahaj.zone 11 months ago
The AI is not the reason their software is bad, but their software is bad for the same reason they’re claiming to use AI to write it.
D_C@lemm.ee 11 months ago
Ok, it’s like this.
Ms used to release shitty stuff. And they’ll continue to release shitty stuff except now it’ll be 30% more shitty.
Wispy2891@lemmy.world 11 months ago
There were alpha versions of windows 8 with less glaring/annoying bugs than windows 11, though
ZILtoid1991@lemmy.world 11 months ago
Windows 11 is so terrible so far that if I’ll need to use Windows 10 for dev reasons, I’ll either pirate the extended support patches, or use a shitbox (obsolete PC for optimization purposes) disconnected from the internet. I do fear that I might have to hack a GUI onto LDB or GDB, because I got too used to RemedyBG (I’m already using Kate).
conditional_soup@lemm.ee 11 months ago
My windows 11 gaming machine has done all manner of fucky stuff, including permanently losing desktop icons seemingly at random and just whole ass refusing to open the file explorer for six months.