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Comment on How come as of today I can't access politics@lemmy.ml from lemmy.world?

TropicalDingdong@lemmy.world ⁨5⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

Seems like lemmy.ml is really collapsing in on itself. Overall not good for the general health of the fediverse. We need large “sibling” instances rather than monoliths like .world, which is to say nothing of the politics of the instance. The fewer “medium” to "large’ instances are, the more reliant the whole system becomes on “very large” monoliths like .world, which overall weakens the integrity of the network.

This also highlights the destructiveness of toxic moderation. There is plenty of it here too, but there needs to be some kind of accountability/ redress if open & free communities are going to be a long term project. Not really a big deal in the long run and something we’ll just have to keep working on.

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viking@infosec.pub ⁨5⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
This is very good for the health of the fediverse, .ml is home to too many good communities for such a shit instance. Hopefully now more of the mainstream communities on other instances will get more traction, so that we can block .ml and not miss out.

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btaf45@lemmy.world ⁨5⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

We need large “sibling” instances rather than monoliths like .world, which is to say nothing of the politics of the instance.

Absolutely 1000%

This also highlights the destructiveness of toxic moderation. There is plenty of it here too

I can’t believe that lemmy mods/admins still think they have the luxury of making bone headed moves in a decentralized network. I am determined to get around this and it is the entire reason I am on a decentralized system. We vote with our feet and in the long term it will all work out. I am looking for suggestions for a politics group that is not lemmy.world and not lemmy.ml.

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- Blaze@sopuli.xyz ⁨5⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  
  Absolutely 1000%
  
  Curious, coming from a LW account
  
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  - kfchan@fedia.io ⁨5⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    I'm not a LW fan. In my opinion, they are doing any % speedrun on how to become as bad as Reddit and succeeding admirably.
    
    With that said, I don't hate on LW users. Most of them are probably unaware of the moderator issues from their own instance and are just looking for content.
    
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    bacon_saber@fedia.io ⁨5⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    I don't think it was meant to be an insult to lemmy.world or its users. The post you're replying to is just pointing out some contradiction between a user agreeing with the need to spread out on the fediverse, while doing so by posting from one of the most stacked instances.
    
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  - btaf45@lemmy.world ⁨5⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    
    Curious, coming from a LW account
    
    Why are you curious. On a decentralized platform, It matters where you post TO, not where you post FROM. Anybody can easily switch to posting from another platform.
    
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    Blaze@sopuli.xyz ⁨5⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    I see where you come from, but using one instance still makes it active, encouraging new joiners looking for an instance to join it too.
    
    LW got so popular because it had most of the users at some point, and that only went further over time.
    
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blahsay@lemmy.world ⁨5⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
Nah .ml dying is great for the fediverse. Actually the denizens of .ml dying irl would be great for the world too

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- CrypticCoffee@lemmy.ml ⁨5⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  Wow, that’s a pretty discussing comment. You do not agree with a few peoples views, do generalise and want them to die. You’re worse than tankies.
  
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  - ArcaneSlime@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨5⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    Tbf, if he said that about nazis, who want to kill a bunch of people, he’d be applauded. He instead said it about tankies, who want to kill a bunch of people, but they like to wear red. That was his real mistake lol.
    
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    CrypticCoffee@lemmy.ml ⁨5⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    I’m on that instance and not a tankie. I’m politically left, but object completely to authoritarianism and justification of atrocities.
    
    So yeah, I get annoyed when pricks generalise and wish my death upon me for thinking maybe we should help the poorest in society and don’t think the super Roch deserve every penny they get.
    
    I find it ironic when people are hating on one political grouping and their conduct is no better than the ones they despise.
    
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- Blaze@sopuli.xyz ⁨5⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  What
  
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Lost_My_Mind@lemmy.world ⁨5⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
I slightly disagree. I think what needs to happen is there needs to be general instances, and specialized instances. By the nature of how they work, specialized instances would have more content, but less hosted users.

So Lemmy.World would be a general instance. You can host any community on a general instance, but it will do better if it can be hosted on a specialized instance (which most topics can be).

There may be niche topics that will do better on general instances, mostly if it doesn’t fit into any other catagory.

But lets say you want to follow your favorite baseball team. Well, you know Sports.InstanceName has all the sports. So you go there, search for your team and find TeamName@Sports.Instance

And if everybody did this, the fediverse would at least make sense.

But lets say you want a community based on collecting toe nail clippings from the right foots pinky. Well, I can’t imagine a specialized instance would ever be made that you’d include THAT community. So you go to RightFootPinkyToeNailClippings@Lemmy.World and it will have like 3 subscribers.

Now, back to the baseball team for a second. IF you only come to the fediverse to talk baseball, maybe you’re fine being hosted on Sports.Instance. However most people would want their home instant to be a general instance. So that when they click “local” they get a bit of everything, whereas you hosted on the sports instance would only get sports.

The problem I see with the fediverse is there is a HUUUUUUUUGE learning curve. When you first get here, with zero introduction to the concepts of the platform, you’re just thrown in. I’ve even been insulted by people who assumed I didn’t know how the platform worked. Saying “You’re supposed to sort by subscribed, dumbass!”. The thing is, the problem I was describing WAS sorted by subscribed.

The way I’m describing, a new user can know "oh, this is where I find the sports, this is where I find the music, this is where I find the TV, ect ect ect.

You can still make SportsTeam@Lemmy.World, but without people looking for it there, you won’t get many people subscribing unless there’s some MAJOR issue with Sports.Instance.

You could also make Baseball.Instance. whereas Sports.Instance would be more of an all inclusive to all sports instance, which would help smaller sports communities grow, Baseball.Instance would be all about baseball communities.

And if I seem like I’m explaining the obvious, thats good. Thats the point. I want it to be obvious what every instance/community is, where it is, before you even seek it out or click it.

Beevisandbutthead@tv.instance. That doesn’t exist, but even as a hypothetical example, you already know what that community is going to be, and what that entire instance is catered to. You CAN’T click it, because it’s hypothetical, but you already know what it is.

That + a guide to the fediverse would go a LOOOOOONG way for newbies. I still don’t know how to visit Lemm.ee main page for example, without going there directly so I can stay logged in. I can figure out how to go to individual communities while logged in (and that whole process needs a simplification while we’re on the topic), but I can’t go to the main page, so I can click local, and see whats actively being posted to the whole instance like I can on my own instance. Theres probably a way…and it’s probably a bunch of overly complicated series of steps that isn’t naturally intuitive. Which is the biggest hurdle for this platform.

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- Blaze@sopuli.xyz ⁨5⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  
  That + a guide to the fediverse would go a LOOOOOONG way for newbies
  
  !newtolemmy@lemmy.ca
  
  but I can’t go to the main page, so I can click local, and see whats actively being posted to the whole instance like I can on my own instance. Theres probably a way…
  
  There is not
  
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  - Lost_My_Mind@lemmy.world ⁨5⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    
    !newtolemmy@lemmy.ca
    
    That should be the first thing new users see. But also, it doesn’t go as far as I’m imagining. I’m imagining more of a wiki, with every single instance, with a description of what kind of content goes on that instance. What is that instance’s personality?
    
    And then again for each individual community. You’d know which communities are active, and which not if the wiki doesn’t even have anyone that updates the wiki.
    
    There is not
    
    Well that removes a HUGE source of potential that Lemmy could have. It would be the second most useful new feature they could implement.
    
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    Blaze@sopuli.xyz ⁨5⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    
    You’d know which communities are active
    
    There is a weekly thread on !newcommunities@lemmy.world to promote active communities
    
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FaceDeer@fedia.io ⁨5⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

Seems like lemmy.ml is really collapsing in on itself. Overall not good for the general health of the fediverse.

I'd argue that a biased overly-centralized instance like that collapsing in on itself is good for the general health of the Fediverse.

there needs to be some kind of accountability/ redress if open & free communities are going to be a long term project.

The redress is having lots of servers to switch to, much like how on Reddit the redress was "start your own subreddit if the one you're on is moderated poorly." I can't imagine any system that would let you "take control" of some other instance without that being ridiculously abusable.

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