Comment on Google's trying to DRM the internet, and we have to make sure they fail

speaker_hat@lemmy.one ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

• CatZoomies@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  It’s a long video with many points and better if you watch it. However, here’s a quick break down of some of the key points, made to be as simple as possible - there’s a lot more technical stuff, but I’ll try to keep it concise and less technical:

  1. Google owns Chrome (not Chromium), and they dominate the market ever since they won the internet browser wars.
  2. As an amoral corporation (not evil, simply lacking morals), their business runs on advertisements.
  3. They’re revealing a new feature called Manifest v3 which is a locked down version of the browser that’s built around what they feel is security and trust.
  4. Under their proposal for Manivest v3, your browser will have to be “verified” in an attempt to keep you “safe”. Are you a human or a bot? They’re making a more trusted internet with trusted software.
  5. Companies like Netflix, news web sites, etc. will eat this up and implement the proper protocols to use Manifest v3. To visit your bank’s web site which has this protocol, you’ll need to use Chrome’s browser.
  6. Using Chrome’s browser, you’ll need to authenticate yourself and become a “trusted” user. With this enabled, you can then visit your bank’s web site.
  7. If you use an alternative browser that isn’t approved, you won’t be able to use that web site.
  8. Eventually other corporations will implement these protocols, too, and you’ll be locked out from participating in the internet.

  Why is this bad:

  1. It’s censorship. It’s like your mom and dad grabbing your phone, computer, enabling severe parental controls, giving it back to you, and they get to see and approve what you’re allowed to do and say at any time. Apply that same protocol to your money, too. Want to send money through the internet using PayPal? Even more censorship.
  2. It buries competition and makes Google even more of a monopoly. We already know Google Search is bad (advertisements, phishing web sites, auto-generated content web sites are always the first results in Google.
  3. Digital Rights Management. Just a bit north of 20 years ago, when you purchased a digital product, you could own it. Streaming didn’t exist. In an age where “buying” no longer means “owning”, this new protocol will further enforce DRM. Pay for Netflix and want to watch it? You’ll have to be a Trusted User that uses Chrome. Bought a new video game you’re excited to play on Steam? You’ll need to be a Trusted User. Don’t want to stream music through Spotify and instead use something like Bandcamp? To make a purchase at Bandcamp, you’ll need to be a Trusted User. Don’t want to buy something through Bandcamp and instead just download what you already paid for? You guessed right - you’ll need to be a trusted user to even login and reach your downloads. Don’t forget your downloads are hosted on servers that are run by Google and Amazon - you’ll have to be a trusted user in order to download from that server.

  Can I use Firefox and stop using any Chromium browser

  • Most browsers are Chromium: Chrome, Brave, Ungoogled Chromium to name a few. They will all eventually implement Manifest v3, and if they don’t, they will disappear.
  • Firefox is not Chromium, but think about how many users use Firefox now. Google Chrome has the overwhelming market share and has captured users into their platform.
  • Because the majority of users use Chrome, corporations have to evolve to adopt Manifest v3: banking web sites, governments, job applications, benefits, healthcare, personal emergency, etc. All of these will be forced to adopt it because that’s where the users are.
  • If you use Firefox now and continue to use it, you’ll be safe for several years. For now.

  What can we do?

  • Right now, you can opt out of using Chrome by using Firefox and other decentralized tools.
  • In the not too distant future, there’s not much that you can do. Educating users to switch from Chrome, use Linux, use stock Android (e.g., Graphene OS), will not help.
  • Eventually, you will get locked out.
  • Write your politicians and hope that some governments will help restrict this rollout. Keep in mind though that some version of this will get passed and approved.

  What will happen 20 years from now?

  • Humans have tenacity. You can only frustrate humans so much before they break. Take away too many of their freedoms, impose many restrictions, and eventually they will break.
  • The trick for all of time, seen throughout history by all our overlords, kings, emperors, etc. is to find a careful balance. Take away “just enough” freedoms. Give them “just enough”. Work them until they’re tired, but don’t let them break. And of course, give them a few handouts here and there, but not enough to make their lives easy.
  • Manifest v3 (or its derivative) will be implemented. There’s no doubt about that at all.
  • The 99% of the population will continue to use these services because they want to be able to participate: They have to pay bills, access money, access healthcare, use government systems, do education, have entertainment, etc.
  • The 99% will continue to use this because they won’t care. So long as they can be happy enough, they will persist.
  • Eventually, an infinitesimally small minority will be affected by something. Something will break and cause them to snap, and they will do the only thing that an individual human can do: opt out.
  • That small minority will leave, opt out, and refuse to participate in the system. Those clusters will grow at an extremely small amount because they’re able to recognize the whole picture and see that personal freedoms are so restricted. Enter decentralization - the removal of power from centralized powers.
  • Those who recognize decentralization will build new platforms, and others will eventually follow. This is why the Fediverse and Bitcoin exist. They recognize the problem of centralization and are full of users who decided to opt out.
  • In 30 years when more of the population realizes their freedoms are under attack, they’ll consult the ones who left 10 years previously.
  • In 40 years, you might have choice. The trick is to train yourself to see the big picture. You’ll never defeat your overlords - they’re behind tall walls and they control the money. However, you can opt out. You can refuse to participate.

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  • LeaveITtoThePros@sh.itjust.works ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    If I could save up my votes to upvote this 5 or 6 times, I would. Great write-up! I’m “stealing” it (with attribution).

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  • ipkpjersi@lemmy.one ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    This is a depressing reality but I think it’s likely this will happen. It makes me so mad Google got as big as they did. Someone needs to tear the fuckers down.

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  • SankaraStone@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    You wrote all this but you failed to mention that Google’s using it’s monopoly market position to force web “standards” unilaterally (without an independent/conglomerate web specification standards where Google is only one of many voices) that will disadvantage its competitors and force people to leave its competitors.

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    • CatZoomies@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      Fair point you raise. Competitors can certainly sue where warranted.

      And we can certainly start public outcry. It will be a difficult, uphill battle for those that understand the implications of this motive.

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      • SankaraStone@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        Sorry. I keep failing at tracking where each conversation’s happening. Here are the complaint websites

        www.ftc.gov/…/report-antitrust-violation (Lina Khan’s the most vigorous fighter I’ve seen on these grounds in my lifetime).

        www.justice.gov/atr/citizen-complaint-center

        competition-policy.ec.europa.eu/…/complaints_en

        We’re having a discussion about it here: old.lemmy.world/post/2060683

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      • SankaraStone@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        Those complaint websites are tailored to the customers who suffer from the decline in competition. We are suffering from Google using its market position to kill our user experience and options. As I understand, it’s classic monopoly abuse.

        In the 20th century, the US broke up the Hollywood model where companies owned both the studios and the theaters (how you have 20th century Fox (or just 20th century now) and Fox theaters). Google owning 75% online advertising and 75% of web browser share is a clear conflict of interest and you can see it from how they’re pushing things like Manifest V3 via their browser (especially when you consider how Chrome is the default browser on their phones), now that it’s the only browser that developers are increasingly starting to support.

        If you follow that model, one thing that’s going to have to be done is to have Chrome/Chromium browser development be broken away from Google proper. Google can’t fund the developers any longer.

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  • darthfabulous42069@lemm.ee ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    So basically, we’re going to have to build a separate internet that rejects this new protocol and allows for alternate browsers. That tactic, combined with piracy and offering everything the big guys charge money for for free, might be enough to draw at least a chunk of the people away from it.

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    • CatZoomies@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      You’ve got it right. the thing is that corporations will have to adopt to these standards, but that doesn’t stop us from opting out via decentralized methods and, if you favor it, piracy.

      You can spin up your own media server like Jellyfin and serve content to users in your own enclave. Open it to the public and it’s ripe for DMCA takedown.

      We can spin up our own social media places and collaborate together. There’s lots of options out there to meet every need. Maybe over time as storage gets cheaper, we’ll figure out how to decentralize large media like movies and tv shows over some kind of distributed service like an open blockchain, and then we can say goodbye to YouTube. Or the YouTube alternatives (not the front ends) will become easier with less friction, and user-supported server costs.

      The one thing we couldn’t spin up though are core services that I mentioned - banking, healthcare, government sites, etc.

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      • darthfabulous42069@lemm.ee ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        The one thing we couldn’t spin up though are core services that I mentioned - banking, healthcare, government sites, etc.

        🤔 Actually, if we banded together and had enough people with the know-how and willpower, we could in principle open up our own credit union. Credit unions are alternatives to banks and are specifically designed for shit like this. Just as there are teachers’ and firefighters’ credit unions, so too could there be one for, say, us Lemmonades.

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  • speaker_hat@lemmy.one ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    Thank you for the informative comment

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    • CatZoomies@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      Happy to help. As I sat here and reflected on my post I figured out a good way I can satisfy the “Explain Like I’m Five” better. So I’ll share this for posterity:

      • Google and Chrome is like mom and dad. You live in your house in a nice neighborhood. You use the internet, watch tv, and go to your friends houses to play with them.
      • One day mom and dad want to make sure that you’re safe since they don’t know what you’re up to. So they now request you to ask them for permission before you can go to your friends. You also now have to let them know what you’re doing. It goes well, your mom and dad are happy.
      • Other moms and dads notice how nice and respectful you are, and they decide they’ll be like your parents since they can trust them.
      • Over time, other parents also enable these same rules so they can keep the kids safe while knowing what they’re up to.
      • Moms and dads monitor your sleepovers. They press their ears against your closed door while you hang out with your friends.
      • Eventually your mom and dad decide you don’t need your computer and phone, and they give you new ones that are so much easier to use but require their permission to use. You can still visit your friends and message them, but you have to do it on that computer or phone, else you won’t be able to talk to them.
      • Other moms and dads do the same, seeing that they can now trust everyone.
      • The neighborhood is now safer. All the parents know what the kids are up to.
      • You on the other hand, miss what it was like before. It makes you a little sad that you have to get all this permission and you feel like you’re being watched. But, you guess it’s okay. At least you can see your friends. But it just feels different for some reason and you can’t really explain why.

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      • speaker_hat@lemmy.one ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        Wow, awesome ELI5 thanks!

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  • capr@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    I thought Brave doesn’t have to implement manifest v3 because they’re a fork. They can just rip it out.

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  • cincinmasukmangkok@lemmy.my.id ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    We can create a community of people that care about those things & shun people that don’t care

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    • CatZoomies@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      Why shun them? Shouldn’t we welcome them when they decide to join us?

      No one likes an evangelist, so I think it’s best to not try to recruit people; Rather, we can make others aware of this problem by making announcements that state facts about what’s going on. Then we leave the 99% to figure it out and decide for themselves.

      I never heard of Lemmy, but I’ve been disenfranchised by other social medias and simply walked away. After the Reddit API scandal, I discovered the Fediverse (after hearing vaguely about Mastodon years ago). Let them come on their own. We should welcome all refugees.

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      • cincinmasukmangkok@lemmy.my.id ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        If they want to join it’s ok, but if they leave or they don’t want to join we shun them, because making average people aware doesn’t work, they simply don’t care

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