Comment on Epic win: Jury decides Google has illegal monopoly in app store fight

• takeda@lemmy.world ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  No, then you won’t even be able to use in-app purchases.

  Android supposedly has an option to side load, and even install another store, but in order to do it, you get through a series of warnings, and such stores can’t even be on the play store. So for an ordinary user you feel like you are hacking the phone. So naturally there aren’t many alternatives. The only one that lasted is F-Droid, but it seems to be only used by advanced users who want to run open source software.

  So simply, theoretically they should be able to do whatever they want practically everyone has to stick to play store.

  Play store has a rule, that additional charges need to go through them (and they of course charge 30%). This probably would still be ok, but then certain vendors don’t need to follow the same rules.

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  • d3Xt3r@lemmy.nz ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    No, then you won’t even be able to use in-app purchases.

    That’s not true - they wouldn’t be able to use the Google Play APIs for payments of course, but if the app is sideloaded they can definitely use any payment processor / method. If the app isn’t on the Play Store then Google has no say over it. The issue was Google was pressuring Epic into using the Play Store (allegedly) so that they could get their 30% cut, but I’m not even sure how they’d do that, when

    Android supposedly has an option to side load, and even install another store, but in order to do it, you get through a series of warnings

    It’s really not as difficult as you make it seem.

    1. Send a link to the user somehow (SMS, email etc); or user goes to the website
    2. Click on the Download button
    3. Open the APK
    4. In the dialog box that pops up, click on the Settings button > then tick Samsung Internet
    5. Click on the Install button

    That’s it. There were no “series of warnings” to go thru, no need to flip between multiple screens or anything. I literally just went thru this process to install the Epic store my Galaxy Fold 4, and it was in no way complicated or “scary” at all. And bear in mind that the audience in this case were gamers - gamers who are already used to the concept of downloading and installing programs on their PC, so it’s not like you’re targeting some tech-illiterate people here.

    The only one that lasted is F-Droid

    Not true again. Aurora Droid and Droid-ify are both reasonably popular, at least in the OSS/enthusiast communities. Yes they use the F-Droid repos but they also subscribe to other repos (Guardian Project, Izzy etc), so you’re getting your apps from multiple sources.

    There are also proprietary stores such as Aptoide which are quite popular in the Asian markets. Finally, you’re completely ignoring other stores which are bundled out-of-the-box phones, such as the Galaxy Store on Samsungs, Mi Store on Xiaomis, AppGallery on Huawei etc. Of course, in the western market the Play Store is the most dominant, but the Samsung store is reasonably popular among Samsung users (as they have regular deals on games and various other apps + some exclusives like Good Lock and other Samsung-specific apps), and of course, the OEM stores are quite popular in Asian markets.

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    • Gestrid@lemmy.ca ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Not OP, and, correct me if I’m misremembering, but you did actually used to have to enable developer options to be able to sideload at all, and Android doesn’t tell you how to do that.

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    • yamanii@lemmy.world ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      You seem too certain that it’s still simple, but everytime I’m installing a new APK my Xiaomi makes me wait 10 seconds and puts a big, red, scary sign saying how dangerous it is to side load, then finally the ok buttons unlocks and I install my app.

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      • helenslunch@feddit.nl ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        That’s a problem with Xiaomi, not Google or Android.

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  • helenslunch@feddit.nl ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    No, then you won’t even be able to use in-app purchases.

    I didn’t realize that. Never actually tried to buy anything. You can’t even make purchases in the Samsung store? Or Huawei?

    Android supposedly has an option to side load, and even install another store, but in order to do it, you get through a series of warnings, and such stores can’t even be on the play store.

    Yes you can, and I have several times. You are put through a series of warnings just like you are when downloading an executable in the browser, or installing it on Windows. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with that.

    Play store has a rule, that additional charges need to go through them

    But we’re not talking about Play Store…

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    • d3Xt3r@lemmy.nz ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      No, then you won’t even be able to use in-app purchases.

      I didn’t realize that. Never actually tried to buy anything. You can’t even make purchases in the Samsung store? Or Huawei?

      OP is mistaken - you can make purchases in side-loaded apps, only thing is that app can’t use the Google Play APIs for that (obviously) - but they’re free to use PayPal or stripe or w/e payment method. Google has no way of preventing sideloaded apps from doing that, and it’s not like they can ban them either.

      You are put through a series of warnings just like you are when downloading an executable in the browser, or installing it on Windows.

      Actually, there isn’t even any actual “warning” - at least not on my Fold 4 - there was just one dialog to enable installation from unknown sources, with a “Settings” button that takes you directly to the page where you need to tick the box next to your browser, and as soon as you tick the box, you can click on the “Install” button to install it. That’s it. None of the dialogs you interact with has any actual warnings.

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    • baronvonj@lemmy.world ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      But we’re not talking about Play Store…

      Epic is, in the law suite they just won.

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      • helenslunch@feddit.nl ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        So the issue is that they don’t want to pay commission on in-app purchases after people download their app from the Google Play store?

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• baronvonj@lemmy.world ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  No I think Google tried to tell Epic they couldn’t have their own processing for in-app purchases. That’s what Epic sued over.

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  • Ottomateeverything@lemmy.world ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    There are multiple entities with their own payment processing mechanisms running on Android. Epic was definitely able to run their own if they wanted to.

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    • Gestrid@lemmy.ca ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Many of them are either exceptions made by Google through shady deals or apps that were overlooked by Google before they published the app.

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      • mean_bean279@lemmy.world ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        That’s exactly what sunk Google’s case though. They’re inconsistent. Had they most likely shown they’re consistent to other apps they could have been more likely to get a jury on their side (like in the case with Apple).

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  • helenslunch@feddit.nl ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Why would they sue Google instead of just saying “nah”? Did Google do something to prevent them from having their own in-app purchases from their own app store?

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    • bassomitron@lemmy.world ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Google banned Fortnite from the app store along with Apple and that’s what caused Epic to sue both of them in the first place.

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      • Gestrid@lemmy.ca ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        It’s more that Epic added their own payment system to the app, Google and Apple both responded by removing the app, and then Epic sued them both and even aired a special presentation in Fortnite. All in the same day. Epic intentionally did this.

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      • ram@bookwormstory.social ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        Well, Epic instigated them to ban the app so they could claim the ban as a tort under competition law.

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