Comment on You've probably met someone who has killed a person
django@discuss.tchncs.de 3 weeks ago
I know a train operator. They are sometimes involuntary involved in other peoples suicide.
Comment on You've probably met someone who has killed a person
django@discuss.tchncs.de 3 weeks ago
I know a train operator. They are sometimes involuntary involved in other peoples suicide.
orgrinrt@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
That has to be one of the worst choices if you must go. I get that we don’t think straight in those moments of our life, but it’s such a horrible thing to force on someone and their conscience…
Not just trains, but all the instances where someone entirely unrelated will be dragged into something so heavy, like truck drivers, too. Hard to live with, can really ruin lives.
Another thing I don’t like is when others that aren’t trained for it like the paramedics or police, have to see the outcome and fallout, such as jumping off a building into a busy street, even at night when nobody’s there just now, but will be. Or hanging yourself from your balcony in an apartment complex.
It fucks up someone to see that, and I have to believe everyone could make the responsible choice of doing it in private or in a way that affects least amount of unrelated people possible. Like going with the helium/nitrogen bag, hanging within the bounds of one’s privacy, if shooting is the way to go, do it perhaps in the woods, somewhere peaceful and remote, and call the paramedics so they’ll be there before any innocent walkers-by, etc.
It’s bad that anyone has to be involved, but at least the professionals have the training to deal with that somehow, even if it will ultimately fuck them up too at least somehow. At least it’s a conscious choice for them to put themselves in the position that they might have to see shit like that. Same for police.
I would strongly encourage messless ways to go, too, because I think the psychological impact of a peacful-seeming exit without blood or injuries has to be the least damaging. It’s never going to be clean and harmless to others, but an exit bag would do a lot of good for everyone eventually involved in the situation.
But I also get that a lot of people in that position may harbor some general hatred and bitterness towards others, which is horrible and I have to think entirely avoidable if the society did its job, so they might even choose to go as publicly and messily as possible just to make a point or something.
But the others have to live with that shit. They keep going. You don’t. The least we can do is try to minimize the trauma and impact we necessarily inflict on others when we do go. We get the peace. We get away. Those others, not so much.
I don’t know how this would be taught other than boldly and empathetically talking about it in school, to make the point repeatedly, like we do with sex education for example. And health education too. We really should talk about these things, so when the time comes one has to leave, the spine reaction would be to do it as kindly as possible, to be considerate in the choice of manner.
Hazor@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
I’m a nurse in a psychiatric hospital. When someone is actively suicidal, they indeed are not thinking straight. They are (usually) just looking for a way to escape their pain. Actively experiencing pain (be it physical or mental) reduces our capacity for empathy - that is, to consider how our actions will impact others.
I have had countless patients tell me their method/plan for suicide was to jump in front of traffic, jump from an overpass, lay on a road, lay on train tracks, etc… and none of them are ever, in those moments, thinking about how it will effect other people. Not because they wouldn’t care, but because they are simply unable to while in that state of mind.
I’ve had some who, once they were feeling better, shared about how they eventually realized how it would have impacted the driver of the vehicle (or the person who would find their body if it was by another method). But that usually only happens once they’re no longer actively wanting to die.
I’ve also had several patients who were the person to find a loved one post-suicide. It messed them up.
burntbacon@discuss.tchncs.de 3 weeks ago
Ha. You want to know the training you get for dealing with death? It’s a couple of sentences uttered by an instructor when some bozo in the class has more curiosity than thought and asks about the ‘yep, he’s dead’ policy. Most of the time you’ll have one of a pair who has done it before, and they just tell the other one what to do (like putting on the electrodes or looking around the room to see what else has been done). That’s the whole of it, adding in the jokes that will be told and the mild amusement of watching the other’s reaction when you grab a coke out of the dead dude’s fridge (I didn’t, but the more experienced one had when he was stuck at a house for six hours).
lonefighter@sh.itjust.works 3 weeks ago
Yup. I got a 2 hour lecture in EMT school that dealt with all of mental health and psych emergencies and included a “hey by the way take care of yourself, you’re going to see some really fucked up shit, a large amount of first responders end up with PTSD, the suicide rate is through the roof, if you don’t figure out how to deal with it you’ll be part of those statistics too”. Super helpful. Nothing like the feeling of watching your paramedic partner and your supervisor both crying in the privacy of the back of the ambulance after the death of a child.
Bluewing@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
That was more than I got. It’s part of the reason that the state I practiced in required 2 years as an EMT B before you could go to school to become a medic. At least you knew what you were in for before they spent the time on you.
Tonava@sopuli.xyz 3 weeks ago
Once you get into the deep despair, the rationality disappears. It’s easy to logic “just do it without bothering others”, but the reality is that once you’re killing yourself, things like that don’t matter much anymore. Then the logic can warp to “it’s still better for everyone if I’m dead” or just “I have to die”, or something like that. I don’t really want to say the edgy thing, but I guess it is one of those things you can’t fully understand unless you’ve been there.
Also it’s really difficult to kill yourself effectively in a non-messy way, unless you have access to some proper drugs. My personal choice is hanging by cutting off your blood circulation, since it is very effective and you can do it without others seeing. Someone is always going to find the corpse (unless you manage to disappear in the wilderness for long enough, but then just disappearing is super traumatizing as well for the people looking for you), but in the best case scenario they’ll just find you calmly in a sitting position and even though that’s traumatizing as well, it’s not brains splattered on the wall.
Killing yourself is always horrifying to others, there’s just no helping it. I went so far I took selfies smiling seconds before just to make sure people left behind knew I was happy doing it, because that was the only solace I could give others in that moment
Bluewing@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
Got news for you, medics and cops ain’t trained for dealing with dead people. The cops I worked around as a medic were some of the most squeamish people at messy scenes.
Nor are you trained to climb up out of a drainage ditch and explain to a Mother that her 13 year old son is dead down there, pinned under a 4-wheeler, and not me or god can fix it. (A tee shirt I got) Or a family about why their son and brother is hanging 30 feet up in the air by a rope. (Another tee shirt I got)
I got a closet with maybe a tiny bit more of my share of tee shirts. But I sure as hell wasn’t trained for any of them.