Comment on Believing misinformation is a “win” for some people, even when proven false

• Meron35@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨day⁩ ago

  As uncomfortable as it may be, research suggests adopting an empathetic, non judgemental, but firm attitude, without any expectation to actually change their mind.

  This is an attitude broadly similar to that of a professional providing advice (e.g. accountants or lawyers).

  How to speak to a vaccine sceptic: research reveals what works - www.nature.com/articles/d41586-025-01771-z

  Unpaywall:

  How to speak to a vaccine sceptic: research reveals what works - archive.is/1gn2g

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  • porcoesphino@mander.xyz ⁨3⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

    It’s not just uncomfortable though, it’s hugely time consuming. And like, I think we’re getting to the point where more collective time has been spent explaining the world is not flat than the human hours it took to find out the world is round. If the person happens to be knowledgeable then they can kill a lot of time through out “what about X?” arguments (like missing links for evolution) and that requires someone with a lot of knowledge to slowly explain, so the approach also biases towards locking up the most knowledgeable people instead of them being more free to do other things (in the evolution example, maybe biology research).

    I guess I’m not arguing against the empathy first communication, just lamenting how effective the flood the zone strategy is.

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• sad_detective_man@sopuli.xyz ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  I’ve got anecdotes about deradicalizing people or I got links to videos about how the gotcha approach doesn’t work. I’m a terminally online anarchist so unfortunately my knowledge stems from terminally online spaces.

  Beyond that what we have to go by is studying high control groups in the past and trying to better educate ourselves on how they operate.

  My favorite example are Jehovah’s Witnesses. My favorite video about their inner workings has been removed but there’s a lot of documentaries about people who have escaped. Instead This is a channel that highlights the psychological tactics used by high control groups to erode people’s sense of reality and separate them from their families.

  Innuendo Studios has a video about the grooming process into MAGA and a series on the mental gymnastics they’re using to stay radicalized. It’s important if you want to understand why the people in your life aren’t responding to being talked to like adults.

  This is an oversimplification by an “enlightened centrist” who does actually do a great job of prescribing the best advice for trying to engage in debate theatrics: Stop engaging and move on.

  Philosophy Tube is another terminally online leftist but that video describes the fractured models of reality that life in America creates and why you can’t just logic someone out of a worldview they didn’t logic themselves into. This one however probably comes the closest to actual prescriptive advice on how to deradicalize people and it only works on individuals you are personally close to anyway.

  Again, I’m just a terminally online agoraphobe who’s only got personal stories about my loved one’s descent into MAGA schizoid shit. But all of the videos I linked have actual sources you could track down for further reading. Let me know if you’d like to hear the synopsis in my own uneducated words, I in no way expect anyone to watch all that bullshit.

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  • porcoesphino@mander.xyz ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    got personal stories about my loved one’s descent into MAGA

    You and me both. It’s a bit terrifying how much of this has momentum outside the US. The supporters of South Korean president that ordered military rule wearing MAGA hats, or how often the talking points pop up outside the US, especially during US election cycles, from the “free thinkers”.

    who does actually do a great job of prescribing the best advice for trying to engage in debate theatrics: Stop and move on.

    Thinking of my personal experience, I get that, especially on the mental health front. Thinking of societal / political implications though, doesn’t that just give time to scatter information that’s hard to dislodge? A lot of what I’ve heard is the importance of prebunking, like what’s written in The Debunking Handbook (2020) no.

    Let me know if you’d like to hear the synopsis in my own uneducated words, I in no way expect anyone to watch all that bullshit

    I’ll save this post and get back to it. I also have a long boring flight coming up soon.

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    • sad_detective_man@sopuli.xyz ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Ooh, thanks. I’ve given up on trying to debunk things to people who’s reality has become highly subjective and vibes based. But I’m going to look at that book anyway. Inoculation is the tactic I’ve been using with my family to try and keep them out of pitfalls and I definitely swear by that

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  • solrize@lemmy.ml ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    What was the removed JW video?

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    • sad_detective_man@sopuli.xyz ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Jawn Louis is the channel’s name. He escaped the Jehovah’s Witness church and talked about being groomed into it as a child and how he got out. It’s just one guy’s anecdotal evidence but he does have the valid experience of actually been born into a high control group and his advice aligns with what’s been proven to help people heal from escaping those groups.

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• TubularTittyFrog@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  yeah, metaphorically punching them in the face.

  people like this tend to only respond well visceral reality right in front of their faces. just think of how addicts have to ‘bottom’ before they seek recovery… it’s basically the same issue. they have to visible see the horrible negative consequences of what they are doing to themselves.

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• avidamoeba@lemmy.ca ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Focus on material arguments, find common ground on the basis of class upon which to make such those arguments. Only make them if needed. We don’t need to have high degree of conformity and we’re not gonna get it either way. And all of this should be anchored to a purpose for doing it. E.g. fighting the oligarchy, reaching better alignment within a family, etc. If there’s no worthy purpose, we shouldn’t expend social capital in convincing people.

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  • porcoesphino@mander.xyz ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Aligning on a purpose is important. I’d argue that being aware of how on board people are for that purpose is important too. I recently tried to say that the family chat should have less influencer posts since we don’t all agree on the positions and it causes friction. Boy was that a shit show

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