Dude im in my 30s and I hate moving. You cant just up and move to a different state that easily, especially at that age.
Comment on This 81-year-old still works at Home Depot to support herself and her 90-year-old husband
partial_accumen@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
I feel sorry for the 81 year old and her husband. However, they have made nearly every wrong financial decision over most of their lives.
- In 1994 husband was making $90k a year and quit that job to start up a band and teach music lessons
- They bought a fixer-upper house in 2002 to flip it, except they still had it in hand in 2008 when the real estate market crashed
- They had $75k in the market prior to the crash, and sold it all at the bottom of the market before the rebound.
- They never saved more than $10k in a 401k
- They defaulted on their mortgage in 2015 and lost he house, but did gain $115k from the forced sale.
- They declared bankruptcy (it doesn’t say when). Usually this protects the house, as in you’re not kicked out. So I can’t quite square why the house was forced for sale if they were under bankruptcy protection. This is a clue they had a lot more debt than just the house.
- “The income from a side business Lydia had started to help people downsize their homes, and the piano lessons that Bill gave, weren’t enough.” This was 2015 and at best their only income was a couple small side hustles. Admittedly they were in their early 70s at this point.
- Even today it looks like they’re spending over 20% of their income on car related expenses (payment, insurance, gas).
- They’re also still living in Connecticut which looks to be more expensive place to live. A quick Google search of West Virginia 55+ one bedroom apartments go for $450-$900. So they could probably cut their rent in half if they moved to a cheaper city/state.
They’ve truly had some horrible timing and luck, however I truly hope their situation improves and
LotrOrc@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
partial_accumen@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
Dude im in my 30s and I hate moving. You cant just up and move to a different state that easily, especially at that age.
Everyone hates moving. The other option is living above your means, which is what these folks are doing which translates into an 81 year old having to work. This also didn’t happen one day out of the blue. They’ve been living above their means for decades and they’ve had decades to see this would be the result of their choices.
Romkslrqusz@lemmy.zip 3 weeks ago
Were they supposed to use their crystal ball to predict the 2008 grift and subsequent rebound?
In your list, nearly everything that comes after that is a symptom of trying to navigate financial hardship.l and being old enough to face age discrimination in the job market.
partial_accumen@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
In your list, nearly everything that comes after that is a symptom of trying to navigate financial hardship
Which symptom cause the husband to quit his nearly $200,000/year job in 1994 and start a band without saving for retirement first?
ChickenLadyLovesLife@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
A quick Google search of West Virginia 55+ one bedroom apartments go for $450-$900.
Bwah ha ha. This may surprise you, but one of the reasons apartments are so cheap in WV is that there are no jobs in WV. And definitely not jobs for octogenarians.
partial_accumen@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
Bwah ha ha. This may surprise you, but one of the reasons apartments are so cheap in WV is that there are no jobs in WV. And definitely not jobs for octogenarians.
If they are living in WV, as an example, they don’t need the additional income from a job to live. I’m suggesting they move *so they don’t have to work.
Psionicsickness@reddthat.com 3 weeks ago
Cool. A majority of people my age are in the same boat without being cursed/dipshits.
Can’t give a fuck about a poor boomer. Fuck em.
nickwitha_k@lemmy.sdf.org 3 weeks ago
Sorry but your last point is absolutely asinine. It ignores the hardships caused by relocating, the fact that rural hospitals like those available in WV are continuously shutting their doors as they are deemed unprofitable (the husband has health problems), and the fact that, based upon a wealth of international studies, the isolation from social support networks that they’d assuredly face, is pretty much a death sentence.
So, from that point alone, your statement could be paraphrased as: “They don’t need to live in such an unaffordable place; they could just die instead.”
partial_accumen@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
the isolation from social support networks that they’d assuredly face, is pretty much a death sentence.
They are THIS CLOSE to homelessness right now. Is homelessness for an 81 year old woman with a 90 year old husband not also a death sentence?
partial_accumen@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
Sorry but your last point is absolutely asinine.
…and…
is pretty much a death sentence.
What do you call being forced to work at 81 (with a 90 year old non-working husband), and only being able to work 4 of the 5 hour shift because you’re exhausted? How about the fact that they are THIS CLOSE to being homeless if she doesn’t work? They’ve had bad luck and made bad choices for most of the second half of their lives. We don’t have any good solutions left only least worst.
You’re saying that moving is a death sentence. I’m saying homelessness is, which is what is in their near future.
nickwitha_k@lemmy.sdf.org 3 weeks ago
What do you call being forced to work at 81 (with a 90 year old non-working husband), and only being able to work 4 of the 5 hour shift because you’re exhausted?
I call it “absolutely fucked up”.
You’re saying that moving is a death sentence. I’m saying homelessness is, which is what is in their near future.
Maybe I took you the wrong way, if so, my apologies. I think that this is a case of both statements bring correct. They are effectively being murdered through fiscal policy and corruption.
roofuskit@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
Pretty much all rural hospitals will close when the Medicaid cuts take effect after the next midterms.
Dogyote@slrpnk.net 3 weeks ago
Why is it that every comment chain about an unfortunate event has at least one callous person who is obviously victim blaming but trying their best to downplay it?
I’ll ask you directly, why are you doing this, partial_accumen? Are you trying to convince yourself that this couldn’t happen to you? Are you perhaps trying to convince yourself to stick with your soul-sucking yet decent paying job? What’s your motivation?
partial_accumen@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
Why is it that every comment chain about an unfortunate event has at least one callous person who is obviously victim blaming but trying their best to downplay it? I’ll ask you directly, why are you doing this, partial_accumen? What’s your motivation?
I can’t speak for every comment chain, only this one. For this one I CAN respond to you.
For so much of life we are powerless. The forces and events are beyond us and we’re simply swept away suffering whatever fate chances gives us. Its frightening and very real. As an example, someone born into a war torn country had no control over the geography of their birth. They are at constant risk of death. There are only a few small things a person can do in that situation and very few of them will result in meaningful change. They will likely be victim of the circumstances that were handed to them through no fault of their own.
None of that is what this 80+ couple is.
This couple has had opportunity after opportunity handed to them. They chose again and again to choose the risky, easy, or comfortable path. They are still doing that even today in a couple areas! This couple is NOT simply victims of circumstance. They had power and ability to affect massive positive change on their present and future existence throughout the second half of their lives (which is as far back as the article goes). Instead at many turns they chose options that point to THIS path. The one with the wife having to work at Home Depot at 81.
Conflating my prior example and this couple together as simply victims does a disservice to the former. It also paints a picture that the couple’s path is inevitable for all of us, and it isn’t! It is valuable to learn from the mistakes of others so that we do not make the same mistakes ourselves.
Are you trying to convince yourself that this couldn’t happen to you?
It won’t. Something else will, but THIS won’t. Others that look at and learn how this couple lived will also be spared their fate, because we can examine what mistakes they made and change course ourselves so that we don’t end up in their avoidable situation.
I feel sympathy for them, as I have stated multiple times. I fully understand that we all make mistakes. None of us are perfect. Circumstances did a number on them, but they are not blameless for their situation. There are many in similar situations to this couple that are blameless. Those others have much more sympathy from me.
Dogyote@slrpnk.net 3 weeks ago
I would argue that they were in fact victims of circumstance. The 2008 mortgage implosion seems to be the root of their troubles. I doubt they thought they were making subpar choices in the aftermath. Putting the blame on them really shifts focus from the elephant in the room, that our society should provide a baseline level of dignified existance for the elderly and infirm no matter the quality of their life choices.
Suggesting they move to west virginia because it’s cheaper is a ridiculous idea that only someone who lacks life experience would propose. I’m calling out a kid, aren’t I?
Your writing is too verbose and lacks tact.
partial_accumen@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
I would argue that they were in fact victims of circumstance. The 2008 mortgage implosion seems to be the root of their troubles.
I would disagree with you. The root of their trouble started in 1994. The husband was making the equivalent of $195,221.66/year and quit that job to start a band. They could have been set for life if he worked just a few years at that job and saved for retirement. How badly would you blame anyone today that quit a nearly $200k/year job to start a band, and then had a tough time covering their basic needs in retirement?
I doubt they thought they were making subpar choices in the aftermath.
It looks like right now they’re paying on a vehicle that cost at least $37,000. They are still making bad choices.
Putting the blame on them really shifts focus from the elephant in the room, that our society should provide a baseline level of dignified existance for the elderly and infirm no matter the quality of their life choices.
I’ll be the first one to say we need something like UBI, but we do have a system in place that provides a baseline level: Social Security. As I pointed out, their income they are receiving today would give them hundreds of dollars in surplus if they didn’t live in Connecticut, but instead in a lower cost of living area. Again, they’re choosing to live in a more expensive place forcing the wife to work. It was no mystery how much they would be getting in Social Security when they retired. I can look up right now how much I’ll get when I retire. The disconnect seems to be them not doing simply math to see what a sustainable path is. Now, I’m sure there is more to it that my simplification above for their specific circumstances, but even with additional complexity the simply math by itself doesn’t add up to a sufficient answer before adding any other life complexity/challenges.
Suggesting they move to west virginia because it’s cheaper is a ridiculous idea that only someone who lacks life experience would propose. I’m calling out a kid, aren’t I?
I lack life experience? I think I could accuse you of that if this is your take. Life doesn’t always go as we want. You don’t get to do something just because you want to. You do what you have to in life to live. Sometimes that means moving for work, or making choices you wouldn’t like to do otherwise. This is a lesson our couple didn’t seem to learn as it looks like they’re living above their means and having to kill themselves working far into their years to continue on this path, nor is it one it sounds like you’ve had to experience yet. What the wife is doing, working at Home Depot, isn’t sustainable. What is their plan when she can’t work? Who is going to pay the rent and the expensive car payment? They have no plan B. They still aren’t looking at their circumstances and making changes to secure their futures for the years they have level.
Further, West Virginia was an example of cheaper cost of living place to live. I’m not prescribing that’s the only place on the planet they can go and live within their means. I wouldn’t not have told them to end up where the are in circumstances. I am simply taking what they have left and suggesting an alternative that addresses the fire in the room, her working at 81 to keep a roof over their heads. On this current path, they’re headed for homelessness if they don’t change course.
Your writing is too verbose
Sorry, this is how I talk and write. You’re under no obligation to interact with me if it bothers you that much. I’m certainly not changing just for you.
and lacks tact.
Your first response to me was accusing me of victim blaming. I’m following your tone on tact.
MangioneDontMiss@lemmy.ca 3 weeks ago
boomers…
yonderbarn@lazysoci.al 3 weeks ago
You might be able to make an argument for this grandma, but there are countless others. You can’t deny we have a systemic problem that leaves seniors out in the cold
partial_accumen@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
You might be able to make an argument for this grandma, but there are countless others. You can’t deny we have a systemic problem that leaves seniors out in the cold
My comments are only about the couple in the article. The reason that is important is that the couple in the article are not the archetype we need to solve for. Its, as you point out, all the countless others. In effect, we should not look at this couple to see how to solve the problem of our senior citizens not able to age/live gracefully.
YtA4QCam2A9j7EfTgHrH@infosec.pub 3 weeks ago
Who gives a shit? No one should have to spend their 80s working
MissJinx@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
I understand the sentiment but what he is saying is also important. Imagine, starting tomorrow everyone above 60 will get 5000 dolars every month. Will this couple in particular be able to libe with it or will they make more bad choices.
I’m 100% pro supporting the retired community but Financial literacy is also very important, otherwise it doesn’t matter how much money you give them.
It’s so important to teach finamcial literacy from an early age
a_wild_mimic_appears@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 weeks ago
That’s why you don’t give out money, you subsidize what people need in their age - rent, mobility, care. You can’t make wrong decisions with money that is bound to services - it also means whatever comes, they are neither threatened by homelessness nor isolation. But that would be socialism, and we know how the US thinks about that, regardless of consequences like letting old people die in the streets.
Delphia@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
I will be able to afford to retire where I live, I cant afford to retire in Manhattan or Monaco.
cute_noker@feddit.dk 3 weeks ago
Is that really the only solution? A one liner?
It should rather be possible for some people to live in a retirement home.
FuckFascism@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
I’m sure it was just an example.
partial_accumen@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
They are today still making choices which are forcing them to work. They might be able to not work if they move to a cheaper area and give up their expensive car.
sexy_peach@feddit.org 3 weeks ago
Like move to a different state? They have family and friends there probably and also moving can be expensive.
But I agree, some people can make bad financial choices, but mostly it’s not educated choices. So they need help either way, probably financially and consulting.
chilicheeselies@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
Then they have a new problem; isolation. Given having to work or be isolated, work is better
surewhynotlem@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
What you said doesn’t address what he said.
MangioneDontMiss@lemmy.ca 3 weeks ago
this is the generation thats fucked us over and they’re complaining about suffering through shit we all know we’re going to have to deal with to an even worse extent.
I mean yeah this country is fucked. clearly, the powerful just want slaves. Even so, these people made their own bed to a large extent. Its hard to feel that sorry for them.
sexy_peach@feddit.org 3 weeks ago
So what if “this is the generation”. Doesn’t invalidate that they should be able to retire. Nobody said they should have all the luxuries.
MangioneDontMiss@lemmy.ca 3 weeks ago
Im not in disagreement with you, im just saying i have a hard time feeling sorry for them.