Information to be used against you and never for you.
Comment on Tesla withheld data, lied, and misdirected police and plaintiffs to avoid blame in Autopilot crash
danc4498@lemmy.world 1 day ago
Within about three minutes of the crash, the Model S uploaded a “collision snapshot”—video, CAN‑bus streams, EDR data, etc.—to Tesla’s servers, the “Mothership”, and received an acknowledgement. The vehicle then deleted its local copy, resulting in Tesla being the only entity having access.
Holy fucking shit. What is the purpose of deleting the data on the vehicle other than to sabotage the owner of the vehicle?
ArmchairAce1944@discuss.online 4 hours ago
Shanedino@lemmy.world 11 hours ago
It is possible that the data is just never saved in non-volatile memory meaning that once power is lost that the values are also lost. In which case its not really deleting the information but rather just that information is just never intentionally saved.
P.S. I am not a tesla fan boy just wanted to give this tiny insight.
michaelmrose@lemmy.world 5 hours ago
This explanation is completely fabricated, based on nothing, and nonsense.
It is obviously critical data that nobody halfway competent would write to ram. Also video data is very large and makes no sense to store in ram.
Furthermore the article says it was deleted and they later recovered it which would not have been possible with RAM
Basically why are you pushing this drivel.
Shanedino@lemmy.world 4 hours ago
If the data is temporarily stored until it is transmitted and then is not considered to be needed anymore I see no reason as to why that would need to be stored locally forever.
michaelmrose@lemmy.world 4 hours ago
Because it may not be possible to transmit depending on location.
michaelmrose@lemmy.world 4 hours ago
Perhaps most importantly although we know it was not so lost because we read the article or at least the summary if it had been it would have been a deliberate design decision to have it be so.
Your explanation doesn’t wash in reality but it also doesn’t wash even in theory.
patatahooligan@lemmy.world 7 hours ago
Forensic analysis managed to retrieve this data, so it must have been stored in non-volatile memory.
kjetil@lemmy.world 6 hours ago
Didnt the article say the retrieved the filename and hash, thus proving the existence of the crash diagnostic snapshot. After which Tesla handed over their copy?
Or did the forensics retrieve the actual data?
patatahooligan@lemmy.world 2 hours ago
The article kind of fumbles the wording and creates confusion. There are, however, some passages that indicate to me that the actual data was recovered. All of the following are taking about the NAND flash memory.
The engineers quickly found that all the data was there despite Tesla’s previous claims.
…
Now, the plaintiffs had access to everything.
…
Moore was astonished by all the data found through cloning the Autopilot ECU:
“For an engineer like me, the data out of those computers was a treasure‑trove of how this crash happened.”
…
On top of all the data being so much more helpful, Moore found unallocated space and metadata for snapshot_collision_airbag‑deployment.tar’, including its SHA‑1 checksum and the exact server path.
It seems that maybe the .tar file itself was not recovered, but all the data about the crash was still there.
boonhet@sopuli.xyz 10 hours ago
Hell, it could be that this is private information about the driver and the car’s probably gonna end up in a Copart auction after insurance is done with it, so in a way they’re protecting PII.
aln@lemmy.world 7 hours ago
What PII is there? It’s a fucking dash cam video, it’s not my blood results from my annual checkup.
NotMyOldRedditName@lemmy.world 5 hours ago
Full address via recordings of where you live would be PII
danc4498@lemmy.world 10 hours ago
I doubt they’re doing a full OS wipe when an accident occurs. So PII data would still be on there.
boonhet@sopuli.xyz 10 hours ago
Just stuff you voluntarily save if the crash data is in RAM only. RAM gets autowiped.
danc4498@lemmy.world 10 hours ago
Yeah, this is a good point. Also, another comment said it’s possible the data snapshot is very large, so it’s not intended to be stored locally.
Either way, if you are sending data about my car to a server, it better be easy for me to get this data if needed.
Glitterbomb@lemmy.world 6 hours ago
Don’t these keep a video record of every time a squirrel gets too close to the parked car?
Another m.2 under the dash isn’t going to kill the electric vehicles battery, this isn’t an excuse.
NotMyOldRedditName@lemmy.world 5 hours ago
those are saved on external drives. That being said, they could also have it set to save something like this to the external storage if it was too large for the internal memory as well.
Bane_Killgrind@lemmy.dbzer0.com 19 hours ago
Smells like intentional destruction of evidence.
Clent@lemmy.dbzer0.com 7 hours ago
Criminal destruction of evidence.
Criminal withholding of evidence.
lividweasel@lemmy.world 1 day ago
That jumped out at me too. Giving the benefit of the doubt, it could be that this “snapshot” includes a very large amount of data that could be problematic if stored locally for longer. In reality, they probably do it this way for exactly this type of situation, so they can retain full control of the potentially-damning data.
Clent@lemmy.dbzer0.com 7 hours ago
Bullshit. It was saved locally. It can stay saved locally but be marked for deletion if storage gets tight. This is a solved computer science problem.
There is zero reason to delete it immediate except to cover their asses.
If I was on the jury I’d be pushing for maximum monetary penalty.
Eheran@lemmy.world 1 day ago
If they can transmit it, it is not a lot. It is that simple.
halcyoncmdr@lemmy.world 22 hours ago
Nearly all of the vehicles have 4G/5G connectivity via AT&T. This isn’t a dial up connection. They can transmit whatever the fuck they want.
Eheran@lemmy.world 6 hours ago
Mate, a 1 TB micro SD costs less than 100 $. How much does a high bandwidth high/no data limit 5G connection cost and how long would that need to actually transmit that much?
What sensor data is there even supposed to be? Even at 1 millisecond resolution we are talking about megabytes.
amorpheus@lemmy.world 10 hours ago
Still, if it’s small enough to transmit via any wireless connection, it’s small enough to keep the local copy.
A_norny_mousse@feddit.org 1 day ago
That’s not “benefit of the doubt”, that’s “playing devil’s advocate”. They probably used something like this.
alvyn@discuss.tchncs.de 4 hours ago
The only thing making this nazi company its market value and all the hype is promis of self driving. The autopilot technology is the main value. If there will be proof of it is wrong, Tesla gonna loose the investors. Simply as that, fucking nazi Musk cannot allow proof that his shitty car killed peoples because of the autopilot. I recommend to search for podcast and reporting by The Guardian on this theme. I’m really looking forward to read the book Tesla files. It’s from the journalist who was contacted by Tesla whistleblower. There are thousands cases when the autopilot started to behave just “little crazy”.