Comment on What are some of the impacts of a power outage that isn't that obvious / isn't talked about a lot? And What happens to restaurant bills? Do Buses still work? (since card payments wouldn't work)

• tehmics@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  I’ve only seen those in movies, and I haven’t even had an embossed card in years. but most people (rightfully so) would refuse having their card info written anywhere these days. Things have really changed

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  • spankmonkey@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    People type their credit cards into online stores all the time. In the US, most restaurants still take your card out of eyesight to be processed, although processing devices at the table is becoming more popular.

    I don’t think most people even think about it most of the time in the US because the credit card companies take care of disputes. Europe is definitely way ahead of us on secure payments!

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    • tehmics@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      People type their credit cards into online stores all the time.

      Sure, under the assumption that it’s not being stored without permission, or securely with permission. People are and should be very cautious about what sites you directly submit your card info to, and for less popular sites people are more and more opting to use a third party payment processor like apple, amazon, PayPal, etc.

      In the US, most restaurants still take your card out of eyesight to be processed, although processing devices at the table is becoming more popular.

      One of the most common ways cards get skimmed in person. You should absolutely be wary of this especially if it takes an unusually long time. I’ve been at group dinners where this was commented on. Seems pretty common sense.

      I don’t think most people even think about it most of the time in the US because the credit card companies take care of disputes. Europe is definitely way ahead of us on secure payments!

      I disagree. This is a common point of concern in my experience with customer facing roles, and anecdotally in my social life. When I worked for a major cell provider, for example, we sent a digital form to the customer so that we didn’t have to collect card info over the phone at all. In the event that we did as a fallback, customers were very wary of this across the board.

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      • halcyoncmdr@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        FYI, this is one of the major reasons to use digital wallets. Like Apple Pay and Google Wallet. They don’t use your actual card info when paying, but a generated virtual card instead.

        Likewise one of my accounts provides both a physical card and a separate virtual card, so that’s what I enter whenever making online purchases. Easier to cancel and reissue a virtual card if there is fraud.

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  • HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    I mean, if it was at the Greek place I’m a regular at, I wouldn’t mind leaving them my card. I know the owner well enough to trust her and I’d be giving it to her directly (she lives next door to the restaurant). If it was taco bell? Hell no, they can eat the loss today I’ll be back tomorrow to pay.

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• litchralee@sh.itjust.works ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  The remarkable thing is that modern chip-and-pin cards do support that sort of “offline” transaction, although fortunately without the carbon copy paper. Specifically, a non-networked credit card terminal can present a transaction to the chip, the chip will cryptographically sign this transaction in a unique way, and the terminal will store it for later submittal to the credit card company, when an online connection is possible.

  For a typical “online” transaction when there are no connectivity issues, the third step would send the transaction immediately to the credit card company, so they can have the option of declining the charge. The cryptography is otherwise the same, and it’s why offline transactions are possible.

  Some vendors like SNCF (the national rail operator) in France use offline transactions for their ticket vending machines at rural stations, where there’s no guarantee of being within mobile phone service. The card issuer also usually programs some safeguards to prevent abuse, such as X number of offline max and then an online transaction is mandatory, or a limit on the value of purchases (eg $50 max for offline). After all, there cannot be a check against one’s credit limit when offline.

  In the USA, it is exceedingly rare for credit cards to be issued as chip-and-pin, and while offline transactions can be performed with chip-and-signature cards, it’s rarely enabled since most/all terminals in the USA have been online since the introduction of electronic credit card processing.

  Contactless chip cards might have changed the calculus though, since there is no PIN at all for these transactions. So perhaps issuers might allow a few offline transactions when contactless.

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  • spankmonkey@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    The odds of the power being out are more likely than a lack of network connection in the US, we tend to have generators or other power backups for cell towers and landlines even when the power goes out.

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    • LilB0kChoy@lemm.ee ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      In the US, telephone land lines actually carry their own DC electrical charge which is provided by the telephone central office and travels through copper wires to each phone.

      This is why, during a power outage in the US, a land line phone will typically continue to work. The exception being if the outage is large enough to also take out the central phone office.

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      • spankmonkey@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        The central phone office frequently has its own backup generators or independent power supplies which is what I was referring to.

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• ccunning@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  Last time I saw one of those and the only time I can recall having one used on my own card was during a power outage at a restaurant circa 2000 on a roadtrip.

  It seemed like a relic even at the time.

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