Comment on The best thing *you* can do for the fediverse is *just be kind*

• Cris_Color@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨week⁩ ago

  I think it’s worth being warry of making other peoples misery your own entertainment, that’s a really good way to end up habitually pursuing cruelty

  What you’re describing sounds like Ben Shapiro to me. Scoring cheap points through argumentative tactic rather than actual merit of stance. Personally I see more value in legitimate exchange of ideas where involved parties can all walk away with a more well rounded perspective.

  I see debate as an opportunity to learn from and teach others, not about dunking on people in pursuit of humiliating them

  Just my two cents.

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  • PixelPilgrim@lemmings.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨week⁩ ago

    Lol my argument automatically has no merit without you hearing any of it. That’s like bigotry or something.

    I guess Ben Shapiro argues with people that aren’t media trained to make his stance look better, do you want me to say people Ben Shapiro argues make some awesome argument all the time without exception?

    I’ll teach you that it’s not on me to make your arguments, get your evidence. I just put it on myself to communicate my arguments and poke holes in other people’s arguments

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    • Cris_Color@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨week⁩ ago

      my argument automatically has no merit without you hearing any of it

      I did read both of your comments in full and think about them, but if you have more specific thoughts on why you hold the perspective you do I’d be open to hearing them :) (full disclosure though, it might take me a bit to get back to you- with how much I’ve engaged with this thread I’m starting to kinda run out of social energy 😅)

      I guess Ben Shapiro argues with people that aren’t media trained to make his stance look better, do you want me to say people Ben Shapiro argues make some awesome argument all the time without exception?

      Its a little hard to follow exactly what you mean towards the end, I think there are a couple typos, but no. I just personally see a distinction between productive conversation and making a game of humiliating people buy talking circles around them regardless of the merits of their arguments.

      I can’t know that you exactly meant the latter, but it’s kind of a spectrum and it did sound like you were advocating the idea that it’s appropriate to take joy in making people feel foolish for their inability to argue as well as you. I think there’s a big difference between the merits of a stance and someone’s ability to argue them. That’s why I expressed I disagreed. And that’s why I made the connection to Ben shapio, he’s really good at arguing, and makes sport of trying to make people look bad when they make the sort of arguments I personally agree with.

      I’ll teach you that it’s not on me to make your arguments, get your evidence. I just put it on myself to communicate my arguments and poke holes in other people’s arguments

      I think I see argument as much less of a zero sum game than you do. I don’t wanna score points, I wanna learn about what people think and teach them why I think differently.

      You’re not wrong to point out flaws in peoples arguments, or to expect them to make their case for themselves, but that’s not the same thing as treating it like a game to win. I think the former is appropriate and healthy, I think the latter is destructive and doesn’t actually accomplish anything 🤷‍♂️

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      • PixelPilgrim@lemmings.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨week⁩ ago

        Yeah the merit of a stance is different than someone’s ability to argue. They’re different concepts.

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• Yareckt@lemmynsfw.com ⁨1⁩ ⁨week⁩ ago

  We do not need all the engagement. Just engagement that most lemming users enjoy. The comments of spam bots for example are also good for engagement but are not enjoyable content. I personally hate being pissed of online cause it caries into my real life and people in general also do so most people come to this general idea that they don’t piss anyone of and expect other people to come to the same conclusion of not pissing anyone of. This leads to a less toxic environment which allows them to spend more of their time and energy on more productive stuff. Cause at the end of the day needlessly making other people feel bad for your own entertainment is a downwards spiral if everyone’s doing it.

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  • PixelPilgrim@lemmings.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨week⁩ ago

    So all your saying is don’t engage with bots (even though it’s fine because bots can get you information quickly), and that you can’t ignore negative people online.

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    • Yareckt@lemmynsfw.com ⁨1⁩ ⁨week⁩ ago

      I said don’t engage with spam bots. And no I can’t fully ignore baseless negative comments when I see them. They still register in my brain. I would need to have a filter in my brain or eyes that blanks them out. I wish I had one. Because they affect me even if they aren’t directed at me. Not in the same way but more in the sense that when you see a mother hitting her child on the train you feel compelled to say something. If I don’t I feel a sting and it doesn’t sit well with me. Because I care about others in general. Not implying you don’t. I know not everyone is a helpless child but a lot of people are mentally not in a state where they have the ability to deal with this stuff myself included sometimes. That’s also why I try to be kind to strangers on the internet in general.

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