Its not just the EV, its every layer of the supply chain. From the lithium they mine, the batteries they make out of it, the circuits and metal fabricating. Their government subsidies the electricity, tools, facilities, labor, etc. I work in the engineering field and I see bits and pieces of this everyday and have seen it for decades because I’m forced to source parts from China.
Comment on US to impose tariffs on Chinese EVs next week
gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works 6 months ago
I’m frankly getting pretty goddamn annoyed at all the people who relentlessly fail to understand that the PRC is heavily subsidizing production of basically all of their EVs in the interest of undercutting literally all other countries that are (or are trying to) produce EVs.
By all means, research what I’m saying here to confirm its veracity - in fact I encourage you to. This is economic warfare, plain and simple.
czardestructo@lemmy.world 6 months ago
gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works 6 months ago
I know. I’m trying to dumb it down a bit because the dipshits who argue about this stuff don’t seem to understand the incredible level of complexity of modern-day high tech consumer product manufacturing logistics.
sebinspace@lemmy.world 6 months ago
EVE Online taught me this lesson. Those with the resources to do so will take a loss to price you out of the market, because they know you can’t take the losses nearly as long as they can.
Maggoty@lemmy.world 6 months ago
This isn’t a mom and pop shop. This is the Big 3 in the country with a GDP 10 trillion dollars higher.
Stop sueding red panic, it’s not the 1950’s.
sebinspace@lemmy.world 6 months ago
Okay
gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works 6 months ago
And that’s precisely what’s happening here. A car manufacturer with a whole-ass government subsidizing it is going to be able to operate just fine at a loss pretty much indefinitely, whereas a normal car manufacturer would sooner or later simply go bankrupt (pointedly ignoring the whole “too big to fail” idiocy, which to be honest, while similar, isn’t quite the same thing).
Maggoty@lemmy.world 6 months ago
It’s exactly the same thing.
moon@lemmy.cafe 5 months ago
You say this like it’s somehow bad?
gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works 5 months ago
…it is bad.
moon@lemmy.cafe 5 months ago
Having a cheap supply chain that incentives and heavily costs cut for EVs is bad? I can’t follow this
gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works 5 months ago
The PRC is trying to crush any and all competition. This isn’t them being ecologically friendly or magnanimous in any way. The entire point of this is so they can do the best they can to corner the market, which is easier when the government you operate under just hands you money so you can immediately recoup substantial fraction of your balance sheet liabilities. They are doing this because they want to control the EV market, which will give the PRC a substantial amount of geopolitical power (case in point: look at Taiwan with their chip foundries). And, of course, Party officials and the corporate leadership of their car companies stand to make a fair bit of dosh too.
More broadly, I don’t like when any country does this, including the US. The primary reason I’m singling the PRC out here is because that’s the topic of the post.
Maggoty@lemmy.world 6 months ago
And what do you think the EV rebates in the US are?
Fuck the rich. I need a cheap, safe, and reliable vehicle to get to work.
gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works 6 months ago
Do you understand the difference between subsidizing domestic purchases and subsidizing export production?
interdimensionalmeme@lemmy.ml 6 months ago
Yes, I pay for the domestic subsidy, not the chinese subsidy.
gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works 6 months ago
That is a hilariously myopic and egocentric way of looking at the situation, to the extent that it makes me suspicious that you’re on the conservative spectrum.
Maggoty@lemmy.world 6 months ago
Do you understand that free money on domestic purchases can be used however the corporation pleases? There’s not some magical divide.
gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works 6 months ago
Bro. The rebates go to the buyer. They don’t go to the corps. It’s specifically targeted to make it cheaper for US residents to buy EVs in America.
Cris_Color@lemmy.world 6 months ago
Allowing a country’s political party to position their industry in a monopolistic way is a bad idea. When one group controls an industry they much more easily exploit their consumers. Encouraging folks to buy ev’s in general is different from undercutting prices to create a dominant position in the market that can be exploited once you have no meaningful competitors
Maggoty@lemmy.world 6 months ago
China is hardly going to be able to under cut the Big 3. Unless they just refuse to come down on their prices. More competition stops monopolistic forces, my the other way around. This narrative has been going around like it auto industry is some mom and pop shop that needs protection from Walmart. In reality they’re the monopolistic force in our market and you can see that by the insane prices they are charging.