Comment on This Woman Will Decide Which Babies Are Born

• Red_October@lemmy.world ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  In essence, when the growth rate slows to a certain point, people are dying faster than they’re being replaced, and the trend can only continue unless everyone starts having 10 kids.

  Growth is growth. It’s not tracking only births, it’s tracking births against deaths. Population decline is people dying faster than they’re being replaced, but even “very slow growth” would still mean the population is increasing.

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  • sukhmel@programming.dev ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    There are countries that decline in population even though they try to offset it with immigration, Japan is ahead of everyone in that.

    But every time someone talks about the decline in population they usually aren’t afraid of people going extinct, they are afraid of working hands supply going low imo 🌚

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    • WalnutLum@lemmy.ml ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Not anymore, Japan has one of the highest birthrates in Asia now.

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      • wahming@monyet.cc ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        Uh what. Source on that please?

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      • sukhmel@programming.dev ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        You mean, the rest of the Asia has gone below even further? Also, birthrate isn’t the only factor, and birthrate of Japan is highest among developed Asian countries, it’s not highest overall

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• chunkystyles@sopuli.xyz ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  I’m by no means pro-forced birth. But birth rate decline is a serious issue.

  Yeah, it matters to capitalists who need an inexhaustible supply of exploitable workers.

  For regular folk, it’s not a problem.

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  • Syn_Attck@lemmy.today ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    As long as you don’t care about electricity, water, food, and you’re extremely physically isolated and/or hidden very well and armed to the teeth, it shouldn’t affect you much.

    For the rest of is it’s something to worry about. Once the train gets going it doesn’t stop, and that means as time goes on it gets worse and worse until it reaches a point of stability some X years after collapse. And you won’t be able to hunt/pick your food if you’re anywhere near a city, because everyone else will be doing the same. Also bathing in the only good streams with whatever leftover chemicals they can find.

    Your country can open the immigration floodgates and become a country without borders (i.e. become whatever country is currently your neighbor) but that comes with similar problems listed above.

    So as you can see, it’s not an issue for a small privileged few. For the rest of us, its a big fucking deal.

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  • SupraMario@lemmy.world ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Not really, it’s a matter of replacement. Plus we need a lot more people if we’re going to become a multi-planet species for survival. Nothing to do really with capitalism.

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• Shiggles@sh.itjust.works ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  If only there were people desperate for a better life here, alive now, perhaps in a neighboring country or even entire other continent bordering the states.

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• Blue_Morpho@lemmy.world ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  but unless extreme measures are taken once it gets to that point, civilization as we know it will collapse.

  Population decline is a good thing. Raising a child requires more resources than caring for elderly. When the elderly die, that frees up even more land and resources for the next generation.

  The Black Plague caused the Renaissance. WW2 killed almost exclusively all the healthiest and most productive workers at the prime of their working lives. The result was the survivors experienced unprecedented wealth for a generation.

  When the population declines such that a person with a high school diploma can once again own a home and support a family of 4, the population will increase again.

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  • Syn_Attck@lemmy.today ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    I agree that a Phoenix will rise from the ashes, but make no mistake, there will be many ashes, you and I and most of us posting here likely included.

    But we are long overdue for a reset. Maybe this time we can just skip the internet infrastructure.

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    • Blue_Morpho@lemmy.world ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      I don’t understand why you think there would be any ashes? Extreme population decline like the Black Plague or WW2 caused extreme wealth. Slow decline will cause a slow increase in wealth in the following generations. If we have half the people we only need half the goods manufactured. We had only 4 Billion people in 1980. It wasn’t a post apocalypse hellscape. So if we returned to 4 billion it would be fine.

      The only people who suffer from population decline whether it was the Plague or great wars are the wealthy because their livelihood comes from skimming a little from all the workers.

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      • Syn_Attck@lemmy.today ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        If you reduce the population as fast as its decreasing now, lower than replacement rates, all modern conveniences including infrastructure and faith in the economy are going to take a hit. That includes the internet and hospitals and all internet-dependant companies. Public utilities like trash, shipping - we already saw how many products were discontinued and companies went out if business because of the inability to get parts, over a 6 month (at first) brief shortage of drivers.

        Throw in experienced power plant operators, people that install and maintain pipes and lines, water treatment plants, public transit, everything you can think of will be affected. And many things most people never think about.

        Immigration is a way to slow it down, but almost every country on Earth has falling birth rates at the moment. Immigrants coming from, say, Mexico and Canada to US will only delay the problem, and cause a larger problem for those allied countries we rely so much on.

        You can find pros and cons, and it’s been a while since I did heavy research into the subject, but my takeaway was that once we reach a certain point, mass deaths will start to occur, especially in population centers. Rural communities won’t be affected as much provided they have plenty of guns for defense, livestock, and close community.

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