Thanks for this, I live in Florida and have a conventional resistance electric heater in my garage so I’m looking pretty hard at this. Why can’t the condensate be drained into the water tank to be used in the house? Is it unsafe?
Comment on Heat-pump water heaters are a winner for the climate — and your wallet
IHeartBadCode@kbin.social 7 months ago
Things to note about these:
- Most models are 220V 30A. If you have an electrical already, you likely have everything you need here. If you have gas, you will need to run 10 AWG or 8 AWG wiring and install a new breaker. Depending on where you live, you'll likely need a permit and have your handy work inspected before putting the water heater to service. If you aren't sure when you'll need 10 AWG over 8 AWG, hire a professional.
- The 120V 15A models are slower at heating water and do so for a smaller volume. These models you can plug right into the wall, but they are usually a bit slower at coming to temperature for the water and for smaller volume. There's a Rheem version that's plug-in and has something like a 80 gallon store. However, it is highly recommended for use only in warm climates and installed outside in a small enclosure. Basically if you don't live in Southern California, Texas, Florida and all the states that touch those states in between them, you shouldn't try using this.
- Like all heat pumps, there is an air filter that you need to replace. Usually these devices have apps that will notify you when a filter is needing to be cleaned or replaced.
- Also like all heat pumps, there's a fan motor that will make sound. Luckily, most heat pump water heaters attempt to minimize the sound. That said, it's not zero sound and nobody should be recommending that one of these things be installed in a room adjacent to a bedroom. I mean, this is one of those things that really depends on "how well do you tolerate noise?" But these things will produce a pretty consistent hum.
- The act of cooling the air from these reduces the humidity in the air. So you must drain that water that is produced. I think this is one thing that catches most people off-guard about these. Most water heaters don't have a method for draining water because water around a water heater is usually a bad sign. So you do need to drain off the condensate. You can take a big bucket and collect the water to bail later, but how much water it'll produce is dependent on what the humidity is in your area. If you're in like Florida except something like a hint over a gallon of water per day. But most professional installations will install a drain line for you that leads to the outside, unless you're putting this thing like smack dab in the dead middle of your house and you're on a slab. That would obviously present a slightly higher challenge for that drain line installation.
But all that said, these things are super neato. It's just really important for people to have realistic expectations before installing one.
metalaco@lemmy.world 7 months ago
woodenskewer@lemmy.world 7 months ago
i mean technically, you could use it but it sounds gross to do without a filtration of some sort before it goes to whatever storage you’re referring to.
another thing to note is that most baseboard heaters are OK to use on 12 AWG. If you’re tight on space in your panel, you’ll likely free up 2 spaces in your box eliminating the heater but still will need to run whatever gauge wire is suggested in the installation manual. (if i’m understanding your intention of removing the resistance heater)
SqueezeMeMacaroni@thelemmy.club 7 months ago
We’re doing a major bathroom remodel at the moment and as part of the project are planning to replace the 15 year old electric water heater that came with the house when we bought it. Heat pumps work by exchanging heat from the air around to the water in the tank, which means that in addition to reducing humidity they also put out cool air. Usually they are installed in a garage or basement where that doesn’t matter as much, but we don’t have a basement and putting it in the garage would require a lot more work in terms of plumbing and electrical work, so we’re going to keep it where it is in the house but install vents that exchange air from the attic in the winter, then in the summer we can flip open the vents and cool/dehumidify our house.
They’re expensive up front but there are federal tax credits through 2032 (I think) of up to 30% of the project cost ($2000 max) and on top of that our local electric company is offering rebates of $800 to replace an electric or gas heater with an air pump. So that will reduce the upfront cost by a pretty good amount.
The only thing I’m at all concerned about is the noise of the motor, but the heater won’t be adjacent to any bedrooms so I don’t think it’ll be a big problem in any case.
earmuff@lemmy.dbzer0.com 7 months ago
Not all heat pumps have an air filter. Those operated outdoors usually don‘t have any.
Jericho_One@lemmy.world 7 months ago
Do they get the water as hot as traditional tank water heaters?
oatscoop@midwest.social 7 months ago
So you do need to drain off the condensate. You can take a big bucket and collect the water to bail later
Do y’all not have condensate pumps?
Blaat1234@lemmy.world 7 months ago
What crazy ass compressor needs 220V 30A? Here in Netherlands heat pump is standard as new gas connections are banned for environmental reason, and most homes heat water and the whole house on 7 kW heat, 1.5 kW electric, or about 7A on 240V.
The backup element which only runs at extreme cold outside is a few kW yes but for hot water we just let it run dry and the tap gets colder, no big deal.
Dedicated hot water only boilers have a 300-700W compressor and sometimes a 1.5 kW backup coil. If electrical connection is an issue, just look for a pure compressor driven boiler.
Wxfisch@lemmy.world 7 months ago
They almost always have two high wattage resistive elements installed like a traditional electric water heater which require the 220v/30a circuit. The compressor runs on 220v but sips almost no real current while running.
Blaat1234@lemmy.world 7 months ago
We have two main models here, one with a sizable compressor enough to heat a whole home (7-20 kW heat) and a water tank on the side which doesn’t need resistive backup, or smaller, hybrid models that have a few hundred W compressor and maybe 1-3 kW heat output. The latter are almost all backed up by a gas boiler in a hybrid setup, usually uses zero gas until you run it dry - then the 25ish kW gas powered furnace can provide enough power to quickly fill a bath or send tons of hot water to a rain shower.
Wxfisch@lemmy.world 7 months ago
A lot of these depend on the model and where it’s installed (geographically and within the house). In many areas of the US, there is a drain in the floor near all water heaters as a matter of code, you can drain condensate directly to that (and unlike gas appliances, the condensate is clean and does not need treated to go in household drains). I honestly think the noise concern is hugely overblown and used as an excuse for people that don’t like change. Sure it exists, but if your water heater is in the basement or garage like the majority are at least in my areas of the US, you’ll never notice it. I also look at the cooling air as a benefit for at least half the year, I can close all the vents in our basement for the whole spring/summer and it’s super comfortable. In the winter it’s a tad chilly, but not uncomfortable. Drying the air is also great for our basement, it’s literally a dehumidifier in what’s usually a pretty damp location for many people.
I agree that folks should do their homework and understand what they are getting. Heat pump water heaters are great, but are overpriced at the moment. Even with electric company rebates and a tax credit it cost more than a decent gas replacement would for us. It’s likely to only pay off because we have solar and so don’t really pay for electricity for a large chunk of the year. But I expect costs to come down over the next 5-10 years as these become the go to for most electric installs (and with fewer new gas hookups in new and renovated buildings that’s like to be most installs). Once these hit that $700-$1000 price point there’s really no good reason most people shouldn’t default to installing one.