Comment on Apple Accidentally Leaks 'MacBook Neo'
artyom@piefed.social 1 month ago
I suspect it’ll come with 8GB RAM to ensure the price can’t justify it’s usefulness…
There’s more to a computer than RAM (or even ither specs), comparing what’s shown in the article to the low-cost option you linked the two systems are leagues apart in terms of build quality.
Wouldn’t be surprised if the battery life was miles apart too.
That cheap plastic HP laptop is destined to have its hinge mounts snap away from the upper palmrest through normal day-to-day use.
There’s more to a computer than RAM
Sure, but having insufficient RAM sufficiently kneecaps it to the extent that the other specs don’t matter.
That cheap plastic HP laptop is destined to have its hinge mounts snap
LOL at least if it’s hinge mounts snapped you could repair them. Can’t say the same for the $700 Macbook.
Memory utilization is relative to the user though. For someone who wants to do nothing more than check their email and manage online banking, no specs matter
Just because such a system would not be suitable for your use-case does not mean that it is not suitable for any use case.
Repairing broken hinges on such a cheap laptop practically has to be a DIY repair. I get this exact repair inquiry every now and then, the owner often balks when the repair cost is more than 50% what they paid for the device. For these low-end laptops, I also find that parts are usually less available than those for most Apple devices. Apple tends to use certain part designs / assemblies for multiple generations. Apple stuff is consistent enough that there are plenty of used parts available aftermarket.
Far as your repair scenario is concerned, I can only think of 2-3 times where a Mac came in with hinge related failure and those cases all stemmed from abuse like opening the lid too far / egregious mishandling. Meanwhile, I’ve bread lots of butter with HP laptops whose hinges break through regular operation.
If something costs more to fix but only breaks 1% as often, are you really saving money by purchasing the cheaper solution with the higher fail rate?
For someone who wants to do nothing more than check their email and manage online banking, no specs matter
Almost no one uses their PCs that way. They will, at bare minimum, have a couple of applications, and several webpages open, and that’s enough to cause problems on a modern system with 8GB RAM. I have lived this experience too many times with friends and family members who complain that their computer is too slow, and the only solution I can offer them is to buy a new one, because their current one was intentionally crippled to create a price ladder, and intentionally designed so that they couldn’t fix it.
Repairing broken hinges on such a cheap laptop practically has to be a DIY repair.
It does. But it ain’t hard. Anyone with a screwdriver can do it.
Uh, good luck with that repair.
I’m no fan of apple’s business practices, or the general non-upgradability of their machines, but i’d take apple hardware over cheap plastic any day. It’s overpriced and it’s locked down, but it’s also well engineered.
You’re free to hate Apple, that’s fine, I’m right there with you. But if you think their build quality is poor, you’re simply misinformed.
I didn’t say anything about their build quality
Then don’t buy one. Idk why people get so offended when a company releases a product they’re not personally interested in.
I have no intention of buying one.
People get offended when customers are swindled. And Apple are expert swindlers.
Aside from that, the choices other people make affect your choices available on the market. No better example than the headphone jack. Apple removes it and people scream DONT BUY IT IF YOU DONT LIKE IT, ignorant of the fact that not only this an option that’s no longer available, but that the market as a whole would follow Apple’s greedy lead until the only thing left is a handful of budget devices, for inexplicable reasons.
People get offended when customers are swindled. And Apple are expert swindlers.
So it’s a case of “everyone’s stupid except for me”?
No better example than the headphone jack.
Incredibly vocal minority on reddit/Lemmy aside, your average consumer doesn’t give a shit about having a 3.5 jack in their phone. The market prefers thinner, lighter, and better waterproofing. Know how I know? Because if there was a big market for a phone with a 3.5 jack, someone would be making it, and lots of people would be buying it. It’s not saving these companies a ton on manufacturing to not include one. They cost pennies each when purchased in bulk.
Know how I know? Because if there was a big market for a phone with a 3.5 jack, someone would be making it, and lots of people would be buying it.
that’s not how it works, so I’d argue you don’t know… as Jobs said, he’ll tell you what you want.
So it’s a case of “everyone’s stupid except for me”?
No, lots of other people also understand that they’re swindlers.
your average consumer doesn’t give a shit about having a 3.5 jack in their phone
*Whoosh*. It wasn’t about “the average consumer”, it’s about why people are upset about trends in a market, even if it’s not something they would ever buy.
It’s not saving these companies a ton on manufacturing to not include one. They cost pennies each when purchased in bulk.
LOL you actually thought this ever had anything to do with saving money? Did you not notice that they also released another product simultaneously that now makes enough money on its own to be a Fortune 500 company? They created a problem and then immediately turned around and sold people a solution. Absolute masterclass in swindling.
Apple heard you and released it for $599-699!
I’m not planning on touching them, but in this economy + the Apple tax, I’m almost impressed
The 17e or whatever new phone is supposedly available for 599 with 256GB of internal storage.
Homestly: If the phone i know little android competition in that price range witg comparable specs and polish.
But I’d still get one at a higher price because I don’t like Mr.WalledGarden
I only see a $600 option. What’s the $700 option?
If you go to the official Apple store, the one with 512GB storage is $100 more
Okay so there’s not even an option for increased RAM, huh? 🤣
I got a 16GB RAM M4 MacBook Air for 600USD so it better be cheaper than that if it comes with 8GB…
Unified memory, so more efficient with that. Also MacOS has RAM compression.
I suppose more is better, and 8GB seems like bare minimum for something useful. But one should always mind that now (unlike before 2020) Apple’s hardware has caught up with their advertising in the fact that it’s really specifically optimized for the job.
It’s fine for an “Apple Chromebook” I think, especially if bulk orders for institutions will get different deals.
LMAO you actually bought into that 8GB = 16GB marketing nonsense
No, that’s you happily laughing at the nonsense you yourself said attributing that to me.
I said that RAM compression in MacOS is an OS feature, well-tested and always on. You can play with something similar under Linux and find out it really makes things better. Which means you can fit more there. Like 10%-20% more is notable enough.
And I said that unified memory is a feature of their hardware, which is correct. Which is the reason Intel and AMD were playing with that X86-S idea (a new architecture with much of legacy removed, and also, yes, unified memory), until they dropped it because Intel is going to shit.
I don’t see any marketing nonsense in technical facts. Your GPU can use all the same RAM with less expense for doing that. And RAM allocated to applications does get compressed, which is more CPU-intensive obviously, but happens.
These are obviously correct.
Not who replied to you originally but,
You aren’t wrong (you even stated that more is probably better) , just not necessarily presenting the whole picture.
Ram compression isn’t a benefit only scenario, there is a cost in processing power to make that happen.
So it’s a trade off of memory utilisation vs processing requirements.
Whether or not it’s worth it is down to circumstance, though i agree that generally i think it’s worth the tradeoff.
Unified memory is useful in specific circumstances, most notably LLM/ML scenarios where high vram utilisation is part of the process.
It’s not an apples to apples comparison by any means.
but is it pretty pink with an iconic apple on it? I think not.
Spray paint
Way back in 2007, my one college buddy had an elderly Thinkpad that he’d spraypainted red and stuck an Apple sticker on. People constantly came up to him and asked him where he got the red Macbook, since they didn’t think Apple made them.
Its easy to fool the fools
some computer shops have scrap computers with 8GB of RAM 💀
I have an M1 mini with 8Gb of RAM that I use as my Home Assistant server. I’ve given 4Gb to HAOS running in UTM, and let Ollama use the rest to run a modest LLM for speech to text. It’s flawless.
I’m not suggesting that 8Gb is the gold standard or anything, but for some applications it’s still perfectly usable.
I have an M2 Air with 16Gb, and for what I need it to do, I couldn’t have any less, but the target market for a bargain basement entry level MacBook almost certainly won’t ever notice. It’ll literally just be a portal to access iCloud and whatever browser they use to get on their socials. And if they do find they need more, then Apple will happily sell them a new laptop.
Don’t get me wrong, I think Apple’s approach to RAM pricing has been criminal for years, and as a company they’re really figuring out how to plumb the depths of scumminess, but on this I don’t really see the issue.
With that said, the cost of an extra 8Gb to them is literally pennies, so withholding it is shitty. But it won’t really make that much difference to the average performance of the computer.
There’s no such thing as a “flawless” LLM
The performance with regards to Home Assistant is spot on.
One of the chief things that make macbooks commendable over PCs is the build quality. While I don’t doubt there are very many PCs with better hardware at that price point, often macs are superior by robustness, display resolution, and the quality of their keyboards and trackpads.
I hope this cheaper model doesn’t cheap out on that front. And if it also gets good Asahi Linux support, then it would get me to recommend it above anything else.
We will see soon enough.
I also used to prefer macOS over Windows, but now macOS is also utter shit, especially with Liquid Ass update.
So now Linux is the only good operating system.
So now Linux is the only good operating system
Dear sir, do you have a couple minutes to talk about god BSD?
Xirup@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 month ago
Are you sure? Because at this moment with $400 you only get the RAM.
artyom@piefed.social 1 month ago
I’m positive, thanks. 2x8GB CL16 DDR5 RAM currently sells for ~$250.
Cort@lemmy.world 1 month ago
It’s a celery with a 128GB emmc. Even with 16GB of ram it’ll be so slow.
artyom@piefed.social 1 month ago
So pull it out and replace it.
rabidhamster@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 month ago
Intel celeron N150?
I mean, yeah, technically it’s got more ram, but that’s literally the only thing going for it. I’ve got a mini-pc server with that exact CPU. It’s good enough for what I need it for, by my wife’s 5 generation old M1 Air from 2020 trounces it several times over in terms of speed, even with 8GB.
artyom@piefed.social 1 month ago
An N150 w/16GB RAM is gonna be way more useful than a A16 or whatever with 8GB. Most people will never touch the potential power of their processor but they certainly will be doing a bunch of shit simultaneously.
blitzen@lemmy.ca 1 month ago
You’re absolutely right, that is an ass laptop.
artyom@piefed.social 5 weeks ago
Almost as ass as a an irreparable, unupgradeable $700 Macbook with a phone processor and 8GB of RAM.
Railcar8095@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
This is already less powerful than an old iPad. My SO is looking for a cheap laptop and this one is one I would tell her to avoid like the plague.
artyom@piefed.social 5 weeks ago
Power is meaningless without RAM.
Lfrith@lemmy.ca 1 month ago
Better to get a used Thinkpad with how well those hold up being over thousand dollars, but get discounted steeply to hundreds with companies offloading them once warranty is up. Can get actual nice Ryzen CPUs and have a proper storage.
artyom@piefed.social 5 weeks ago
True, but now you’re talking about used PCs.