Comment on Lesbian group seeks legal exemption to exclude trans women from events
18107@aussie.zone 3 days ago
Will they accept a ftm trans person into their group?
I doubt it. Once you start excluding some people, you start looking for ways to exclude everyone. Choose love, not hatred.
FreedomAdvocate@lemmy.net.au 2 days ago
Yes, if they are attracted to people of the same sex.
Lesbian is a term based on biological sex. “Gender identity” has nothing to do with it. Males cannot ever be lesbians., by definition.
DrivebyHaiku@lemmy.ca 2 days ago
Trans lesbian is a common term. Sex and Gender are linked concepts and in LGBTQIA+ spaces gender takes precedence in self identification. A gay trans man likes men, a lesbian trans woman likes women. You are either ignorant of this or being deliberately obtuse because if you spent time in spaces where these terms are used by people describing what their sexual preferences are these concepts would be second nature.
Lesbians are women (a gender) who like women (still a gender). You would not be required to find everyone of the opposite sex attractive as a straight person and lesbians are not on the hook to be attracted to all women. Being in a relationship with another person uses language that can cause the same psychological harm to trans people as deadnaming and misgendering. If you call a Cis Woman and a Trans man in a relationship “Lesbians” you are implying they are both women. This is an invalidation of the trans half of the relationship and you will cause the trans person to experience heightened stress.
I suspect you simply discovered a dictionary and have decided your definition for yourself and are now attempting to apply it. The reason you are being downvoted is because your narrative is not reflective of how language is being used.
FreedomAdvocate@lemmy.net.au 2 days ago
“Trans lesbian” is different to “lesbian”. This is a lesbian group, using the long established and understood definition of same sex attracted women. Gender doesn’t even come into the equation.
No, Lesbians are same-sex attracted women. They’re homosexual. Again, gender or “gender identity” doesn’t even come into it. Trans women are male in terms of sex.
Sexual attraction is not based on gender, especially since genders can change at will these days. You (a man) don’t suddenly become gay if your wife decides she’s now a man, nor does your wife.
You know what also causes people heightened stress? Males invading lesbian spaces. Males using female bathrooms. Males suing females for excluding them from female only apps/clubs.
Sex exclusive things exist for a reason, and it’s not just to upset trans people.
DrivebyHaiku@lemmy.ca 1 day ago
You know what being misgendered actually does to trans people? I will give you a hint. It’s mental AND physical. It subtly poisons every relationship they have with other people. It destroys their ability to find meaningful social connections. It causes gut, skin and inflammation problems. It literally makes them feel more pain and be less resilient to unrelated stressors. Over time this means endemic health problems or suicides.
What being excluded from “cis women only” spaces does to trans people is institutional. If a trans women uses a male restroom they risk assault. It’s very common for trans women to be stalked to secondary locations once they leave a male bathroom. They still face prejudice and retaliation in female bathrooms but they are dramatically safer and there has been virtually no incidents of assaults by trans people using bathrooms on cis women. They might feel like they are in danger but that isn’t founded on any real world data. They might share a bathroom space with a trans woman a few times over their lifetime but for a trans person having a safe place to use the bathroom is an every single day problem. When trans women are forced out of women’s support spaces they become increased targets of rape and exploitation.
I guarantee you there aren’t trans women knocking down the door to these transphobic lesbian spaces. This is a fucking nothingburger. Trans women face incredible safety problems in dating and I can tell you from experience they don’t stay where they aren’t made to feel welcome because it’s not fucking safe for them to do so. The REASON trans advocates stop these clubs from making this exclusion law is not because they want to force themselves into spaces they on the whole don’t really want to be - it’s because it opens the door to use cases to destroy their ability to exist in public. It makes them unable to support themselves which forces more trans sisters in illegal activities and sex work.
Quite frankly these women can suck it up and be catty fucking bitches to trans women like they’ve always been in the past and deal with the inherent drama of that instead of trying to change laws that will bite them in their own asses one day when they are expelled from bathroom spaces or have the cops called because someone can’t tell the difference between butch and trans.