Sure, I can respect how other people identify, but if gender is simply a social construct, then I don’t understand how someone could be transgender.
I don’t understand how you can’t? Society constructed it, so it exists. Take a rudimentary construction.
A house. There isn’t a “house” partical/chemical/gene/brain structure. Does that mean the house doesn’t exist? Society didn’t have to construct a house, it could have constructed a road or a bus stop, does that mean the house doesn’t exist?
The house exists, we can point to it, we can point to the effects it has on the world: it’s a house now, you can’t just walk in without the owner’s permission or society will punish you.
I have no idea whether gender has a physical component particul/chemical/gene/brain structure/… But, even granting it doesn’t, it doesn’t mean gender doesn’t exist. Gender not having a physical componentcould mean gender doesn’t have to exist.
Like the house, it didn’t have to exist. It doesn’t have to be protected by society the way it currently is. It doesn’t always have to be a house. It still exists though.
Flax_vert@feddit.uk 3 days ago
Sure, you can be assigned a gender at birth, but if gender is meaningless then why would you feel the need to change it?
A house is different to a factory by most definitions, so they are different. If men and women are equal in capability of skill, then I don’t see why you’d want to change it. Again, I don’t criticise someone’s decision, that’s their decision, but there must be something (not excluding something a dysphoria that could have been present since birth, or saying something stupid like “xyz causes transgender”) causing them to question their gender.
Fedegenerate@lemmynsfw.com 3 days ago
But it isn’t meaningless. Society gives meaning to gender. Woman means dresses, man means beard. It’s discordant when you see a person with a beard in a dress. Less so now, as we’re pushing against gender being what defines fashion.
A house has meaning, there are specific laws and regulations that govern how you and I interact with it, but there’s nothing fundamentally “House"y about it. Remove all society and that building is just a building.
That doesn’t mean that “House” is meaningless, it isnt. “House” could be meaningless, but it isn’t currently. We give it meaning.
Taking the least gracious interpretation of transgender: gender is entirely performative. A person assigned Male at Birth grows up thinking that: how 'Man” is performed sucks, but how “woman” is performed is awesome. That’s still, as we agree, a valid experience.
Honestly, I don’t that Trans people want to be trans. What about the trans experience is attractive to you that makes you think people want it? The meds? The surgery? The bigotry they face? The gender dysphoria? Is it the chosen family because many of them were disowned by their biological one? They go through these things because not doing so would be worse.
Flax_vert@feddit.uk 3 days ago
I never said the trans experience was attractive. I’m just trying to figure things out. I guess a third position is then that “gender is meaningless, but just play along”. Possibly similar to a position of “there is no objective morality, just play along” which I cannot seemingly rationalise. Abolishing the idea of gender entirely seems more rational ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Fedegenerate@lemmynsfw.com 3 days ago
Thrice you’ve asserted gender as meaningless. Twice I’ve shown you it isn’t.
A house isn’t just a building. It’s society that gives the building meaning and power. Turning the construction of brick and glass into a “house”. Society gives the construction “House” meaning, it gives it power, it gives it protection. Just because without society all that meaning falls away, doesn’t mean it doesn’t have meaning at all. It has the meaning society is currently giving it. Now thrice I’ve shown you it isn’t meaningless.
Perhaps. It’s probably a good idea to try. If nothing else we can stop using gender to oppress people.
It might turn out that there is a “man” chemical/gene expression/brain structure. All I can tell you is that I am a man. Where my “Manness” comes from be it societal construction, or some biological function I don’t know. I’m comfortable being a man, I’m comfortable being labeled a man, I’m not forced to confront it.
I didn’t say you did. I said you said people want to be trans.