Comment on Indie Game Awards Disqualifies Clair Obscur: Expedition 33 Due To Gen AI Usage
Dremor@lemmy.world 1 week agoMaybe because all AI generated assets got removed?
Honestly, as a programmer that uses extensively AI to debug, and do various tedious tasks like unit tests, I think the whole anti-AI craze of late is more bullshit than sane arguments.
It’s an invaluable tool for many cases, and as soon is it is not used to replace someone, I don’t see the problem. They where used by artists, to be used as placeholders while working on the gme, not by executives seeking to make some more bucks by not hiring anyone.
They forgot some of them in the final game? Shit happens. You cannot expect someone to go through every single texture in a game that probably got thousands, if not tenths of thousands, just to make sure none was forgotten.
Anyway, that’s blown way out of propositions, and feels more like some people trying to get views by hating on something popular than having real concerns about it. Especially since Blue Prince does use AI assets in the final product, and strangely no one bats an eye.
HollowNaught@lemmy.world 1 week ago
This entire comment is baffling to me, in all honesty
Not before being unknowingly sold to the public
My problem with AI is its heavy usage of plagiarism and vast degree of power consumption, as well as the price hikes its caused for many computer parts
Whenever anything is attempting to make money, it should be put under the highest scrutiny. It does not matter who’s pushing it. Similarly, I find it odd that we’re assuming the inner workings of Clair Obscur’s workplace
If you replaced AI here with anything defamatory, like pictures of penises placed by an enraged employee after being fired, then even having a few would be devastating on sales. The single fact that we’re okay with a few means that, over time, that bar will likely be pushed further down the road “oh, it’s just this one character that practically never shows up” “oh, it’s just the skyboxes, they’re basically not noticeable anyway” “who cares if the early access uses AI voices? They’ll be replaced eventually!”
I assure you, AI is not popular. Studies have shown that AI is causing people more concern than excitement Not the most reputable source, but oh well
But guess what did? The Alters
Dremor@lemmy.world 1 week ago
Well, if that was truly forgotten in the game at release, and removed once discovered, I don’t see any problem. The textures that are used now are 100% hand made by actual artist, to my knowledge.
I entirely agree with you there. The plagiarism problem is in my opinion partly resolved by open datasets (OpenOrca, and the like), which means the user has the possibility of choosing to not rely on plagiarism. Problem is that the models trained with those dataset are rarely available on public platform, which is another reason why I use my own infrastructure. Personally I use Mistal-7B-OpenOrca on a locally run Ollama, which reside in my homelab. The power consumption is a problem, and the reason why I use my own dedicated hardware for anything related to AI (which has also the advantage of heating my home a little bit, so nothing is lost 😆). I even invested in a laptop with dedicated AI hardware to be able to make it as efficient as possible. And of course got hit by the AI taxe, albeit I was lucky to get 32Go DDR5 at only twice the usual rate instead of five time the usual rate as it is currently the case.
You are right. But I don’t think they the the kind of guys to seek wealth of fame. They put their energy in a project they believed in, can we blame them to have used the tools they had in hand to try making the most of their limited budget ?
You’d be surprised how often it happen for former angry employees to do that. We even had example in some Disney, with very explicit scenes even going all the way to customers.
I never said that they where OK with it, just that no one can be expected to check every little texture without being expected to miss some of them. Human are prone to fatigue, and I saw many bugs going in production due to such errors of judgement.
As for using AI during early access, IMO it depends on the size of the project. And one man project ? Totally fine, even after launch. A full 400 men project from a big publisher? Not so much, they have to mean to do it by hand. Especially considering how expensive they sell it afterward.
Clair Obscur being a mostly 30 men project (plus some occasional extras), I, personally, don’t see AI usage as a problem as soon as it is sparsely used.
I’m speaking about Clair Obscur, not AI. Don’t you feel surprised that as soon as they get a big boost from the game award, you see people left and right creating dramas for whatever reason they find? Some forgotten AI texture in the final game? Really?
My apology for jumping on that bandwagon. I’m unfortunately not totally immune to that either 😅
On the other hand, IGA did forbid AI on the whole project pipeline, and if I find it a bit overblown, it is their choice, and I’ll respect that.
What baffles me is all the hate Clair Obscur got because of that. The vast majority was made by hand, and the game is good. If the story was AI gen, or the music, I’d agree, but a fucking texture? In which way would it suddenly make a multiple year project shit like some pretends?
HollowNaught@lemmy.world 1 week ago
The problem was that it was sold to consumers at all without consent. You don’t get off scot free when you accidently leave some cocaine for the inlaws to find. There was malicious intent just by not disclosing its usage
You bring this up and imply we’re agreeing here, but I find it odd that you immediately backtrack and say that AI usage in general, not OpenOrca usage, is a-okay. It’s entirely irrelevant what AI tool you use if this company didn’t
Yes. A placeholder texture should be made to be obvious that it’s a placeholder. As soon as it doesn’t do that, it’s failed at its job. By using AI like this, you’re effectively making the QA’s job 10 times harder, as now they have to stare at every texture to make sure it’s not AI generated
Yes. Because information came out on a large platform that allowed more people to hear about it compared to when it was initially released.
I actually played through Clair Obscur about two months ago and gave it a very hearty review on steam, but as soon as I heard that they used AI without disclosing it that changed into a very charged negative thumbs down. It’s very easy to pretend that people just hate things because they’re popular, you see it all the time with youtubers and movies after all. Unfortunately, there’s usually a very good reason that irks these people
You seem to have missed my main point, and it’s not just here, either. You eluded to this frame of mind multiple times when writing these past two comments. My entire argument is that it was incredibly scummy to not disclose the usage of AI, robbing the buyer of any agency in the matter
Me responding to your other points is really just entertaining their idea, rather than engaging in a thoughtful discussion, as the only response you had for this main point was mainly along the lines of the above quote I’m responding to, which is really just moving goalposts
By acting like it doesn’t matter because everything else is good, you’re kind of weirdly conceding the point, as if it didn’t matter if they did it, then why shouldn’t they disclose it?