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Comment on We Should Immediately Nationalize SpaceX and Starlink

Plebcouncilman@sh.itjust.works ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

NASA was always there and they couldn’t achieve what SpaceX has while simultaneously having a lot more capital to do so. I’m sorry but if there’s any proof that private sector’s self interest is a better driver of innovation than common interest SpaceX is it. This is a terrible idea that sounds like a good idea if you do not understand how good Musk was and is at cutting costs. That’s his actual real skill in business and is well documented. Doesn’t make him less of a prick but you also cannot downplay what he has achieved with this company.

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outhouseperilous@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago
The agency that landed people on the moon so long ago most of the people involved have died if old age, and the event will soon pass out of living memory?

The one where when they let a single rocket explode, one time, rocked the nation, because their record was so close to flawless?

The one that constantly gives us new sources for scientific data?

Yeah fuck them. They never made a dick rocket.

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- pupbiru@aussie.zone ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago
  let’s not forget the agency that launched the probe that passed the edge of the solar system and is still functional and doing valuable things…… in the 70s
  
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  - outhouseperilous@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago
    
    and is still functional and doing valuable things in the 70s
    
    Oh, wow, you might wanna sit down for this.
    
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    pupbiru@aussie.zone ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago
    which part? it’s still transmitting right? and they got useful and interesting data from it only a few years ago
    
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- cole@lemdro.id ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago
  I’m sorry… dick rocket? Your issue with SpaceX is that the rockets are… rocket shaped?
  
  Like everything else notwithstanding, physics dictates the shapes of these things. That is why they all look rather… dick-ish
  
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  - outhouseperilous@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago
    Yes im coming out against dick rockets here.
    
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Senal@programming.dev ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago
You mean the NASA who landed people on the moon?

So let’s assume you aren’t a moon landing denier and use that as a baseline, NASA is clearly capable of things given the right circumstances and budget.

SpaceX benefited from his reputation and money, because they sure as shit didn’t benefit from his technical acumen.

Business wise he is successful because he’s rich and influential and that works to mitigate how shitty he is at actually running an organisation, that doesn’t mean he has skills as a business person that means he has money and influence, in his case originally from the mine, then from buying and bullying his was in to businesses that were technologically sound and boosting them with his money.

You could make an argument he’s a relatively good investor, but he’s an actively bad CEO.

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- Plebcouncilman@sh.itjust.works ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago
  When Musk started SpaceX he was not well known yet, SpaceX came before Tesla.
  
  He was able to get into the businesses he has because he was rich yes, but you can find many accounts of engineers that worked under him speak of how good he was at finding ways to cut unnecessary costs.
  
  He’s not a technical genius that’s for sure. But he has been a good CEO for SpaceX. Terrible one for Tesla though, mostly because he bought into his own myth and became a drug addict. But I refuse to simply wave away his achievements simply because I don’t like him. I can not like someone and still acknowledge they have done something good.
  
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  - Senal@programming.dev ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago
    
    They landed people on the moon and then did fuck all for decades.You mean the SpaceX that existed significantly before musk and that he bought his way in to and in addition bought the founder title.
    
    Indeed, all i was saying is that they were capable given budget and circumstances.
    
    That budget and direction comes from the government.
    
    When Musk started SpaceX he was not well known yet, SpaceX came before Tesla.
    
    I will admit, i thought spacex was just another company he bought his way in to, like tesla, seems i was mistaken about that.
    
    He was able to get into the businesses he has because he was rich yes, but you can find many accounts of engineers that worked under him speak of how good he was at finding ways to cut unnecessary costs.
    
    And you can equally find many accounts of having to distract him from the day to day operations because he’s unreliable , unpredictable and chaotic (none of those meant in a good way).
    
    He’s also know for buying good press and using litigation to silence people.
    
    He’s not a technical genius that’s for sure. But he has been a good CEO for SpaceX.
    
    I doubt this, but that could just be bias, i don’t have any actual evidence of the long term impact of him as CEO.
    
    Recently though, he’s provably been significantly more of a liability than a benefit, even if just from a PR and public sentiment point of view.
    
    But I refuse to simply wave away his achievements simply because I don’t like him. I can not like someone and still acknowledge they have done something good.
    
    Indeed, i push back on the myth that he’s some self made tony stark genius, but it isn’t like he’s not achieved anything.
    
    I would personally attribute most of that to neptoism, wealth, luck and opportunity, but that doesn’t remove the achievement itself.
    
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- khannie@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago
  
  NASA is clearly capable of things given the right circumstances and budget.
  
  Absolutely agree with this but there is no denying the innovation levels at spacex are higher (I’m not saying this is down to musk specifically. The man is a horror story of a human).
  
  We were all in total awe when seeing booster stages land themselves successfully for the first time. It was such a giant leap forward and to the best of my knowledge no government funded space agency was even considering it before spacex.
  
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  - stjobe@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago
    Perhaps look into the DC-X program, fully 20 years before SpaceX Falcon: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McDonnell_Douglas_DC-X
    
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  - Senal@programming.dev ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago
    
    Absolutely agree with this but there is no denying the innovation levels at spacex are higher
    
    Undeniably, they’ve been doing amazing work (at least from my rocketry technology peasant point of view).
    
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  - tyler@programming.dev ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago
    SpaceX has an internal team that works to make sure Musk can’t interfere with anything, because he’s so bad at managing businesses. Gwynne Shotwell is the one in charge of SpaceX.
    
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    khannie@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago
    I am not surprised in the slightest. I mean if you have a bunch of smart, highly motivated people it sounds like keeping the crazy man at arms length is the kind of thing they’d organise very effectively.
    
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