Comment on Mars Attacks: How Elon Musk's plans to colonize Mars threaten Earth.

brucethemoose@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

• gian@lemmy.grys.it ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  Colonizing the bottom of the ocean would be orders of magnitude easier. Or the South Pole. Or Kīlauea’s open lava pit.

  While it is true that you have different sets of problems to sole, nope, they are only cheaper to get to, not necessary easier to colonize, except maybe the South Pole where you just need to build something that only need to withstand the cold, which is easy enough and you could go outside without a space suite or something similar.

  The problem with colonizing Mars is the cost, which have as a consequence the cost of everything you send to that place.

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• Cocodapuf@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  The tech you’d need to make living on Mars independent of Earth, like consciousness uploading, self sufficient friendly AI, extensive human/plant bioengineering, terraforming… Well, they’re better at solving our problems on Earth anyway.

  That sounds like a good argument for a Mars colony.

  Not that I think continuousness uploading or AI have anything to do with a Mars colony… Even terraforming is totally unnecessary.

  Honestly, I don’t think Mars is a great candidate for a space colony, though probably not for the same reasons you’re thinking. But I think it is in fact vital that we start colonizing space soon, and I think the technologies developed in pursuit of that goal will absolutely aid us here on earth.

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  • brucethemoose@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    Eh, none of that is something one casually develops for going to Mars. Is tech that fundamentally transforms the nature of society on Earth and being human, and again, is way more impactful than going to Mars.

    Again, the argument I’m trying to make is that, by the time one can settle Mars without supplies from earth, you mind as well get your robotic swarm to make space habitats or something.

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    • Cocodapuf@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      Again, the argument I’m trying to make is that, by the time one can settle Mars without supplies from Earth

      Well, that’s not exactly the goal. No nation is really self-sufficient in modern society. Everyone engages in trade. So the question is really, when will a space colony become profitable or maintainable? And that’s trickier to answer, because it isn’t “not for hundreds of years”, but it also isn’t now, it’s somewhere in between.

      Cheaper access to space would change the equation immensely. Being cheaper to resupply would mean the colony wouldn’t have to be as profitable to be sustainable. In-situ resource utilisation (using water found off of earth for drinking, oxygen and fuel) will also make an enormous difference as it would reduce the amount of supplies needed from earth. (This is incidentally one of the main goals of NASA’s Artemis program, to figure out how to utilize water resources on the moon)

      It was the same situation when Europeans settled the Americas, at first it was just a money suck. Entire colonies were lost, lots of people died, they weren’t really prepared. But then they started to figure out what crops worked there, how to survive harsh winters, etc. Once they figured out how to make the most of this new land, they thrived. Unfortunately, the way they treated the locals was pretty horrific. Fortunately, we’re pretty certain there aren’t any locals on the moon or Mars.

      Truth be told, I think a Mars colony won’t happen for quite some time, but I believe a moon colony will certainly happen before 2100. And if we’re lucky, maybe since orbital colonies. That’s where the future really lies, orbital colonies.

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      • brucethemoose@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        I think the (ideal) future looks more like an accelerated Orion’s Arm, where humanity-changing technologies take over.

        Again that’s what I’m getting at. We will never be colonizing Mars as squishy humans… We‘ll be augmented, modified, interfaced with mechanized AI, uploaded, maybe even just mechanical intelligences, something like that. We’ll be using nuclear propulsion, at least. There will be no need to worry about drinking water or breathing oxygen because that will be irrelevant.

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• phoenixz@lemmy.ca ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  And that last paragraph sort of nails it on the head

  Musk is a scammer, he always has been. He got lucky a few times which landed us to today. He has close to zero engineering knowledge and is a drug junkie to top of off.

  Look close at all his companies, look at what they all have done since he got in

  Tesla… How many new models were made since he got in? And no, he didn’t found it, he bought himself in and through some scheming got rid of the real CEO. How many models are his brain child? One. Yes, that one. That is Elon Musk. Tesla robotics? You mean the guys in spandex suits or the shitty pre 1990 robots that are controlled by some guys that were in highschool 3 years ago? There is nothing of substance there. The robo taxis from yeeaaars ago that will now be there next year? Uh huh… Tesla truck? We’re still waiting!

  SpaceX? They got billions to get us to Mars. They never go beyond the super easy part in rocketry, low earth orbit. Anything beyond that is where shit gets really hard and we’re still waiting. All I saw was billions of tax dollars wasted in blown up rocket after blown up rocket and SpaceX cheering nluke idiots over a blown up banana. Hell, they obliterated a launchpad because btgey were dumb enough to not understand flame diverters…

  Boring? We dig tunnels 1000 times cheaper but it must be just a dumb tunnel with no chance for escape or survival. We can add disco lights though, cool right!

  Solar roofs? The ones that didn’t work and right now there is this huge court case about it?

  The guy is beyond stupid, been saying this over a decade now, and somehow he keeps falling up

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  • gian@lemmy.grys.it ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    esla… How many new models were made since he got in?

    None. But without Tesla you would not have neither all the other models from other car companies. Tesla just started it and demostrated that it is possible to produce an electric car with a decent look (and better that some ICE cars in my opinion) at a time when most of the electric cars done by other company were just some ugly proof of concept (excluding a very few cases) to show at this or that event.
    And I read somewhere that what Musk wanted from Tesla was to set the stage, as far as I remember he said that it was ok if Tesla bankrupt after setting the stage.

    SpaceX? They got billions to get us to Mars. They never go beyond the super easy part in rocketry, low earth orbit. Anything beyond that is where shit gets really hard and we’re still waiting. All I saw was billions of tax dollars wasted in blown up rocket after blown up rocket and SpaceX cheering nluke idiots over a blown up banana.

    Considering that everyone else was not able to do even that, I would not call SpaceX a failure. And it is not that NASA did not have its fair number or launch failures, tbh.
    You talk about beyond low earth orbit like something way harder, but it not really true. SpaceX put a Tesla in a orbit beyond Mars with a Falcon heavy some years ago, and they still have (and use) the Falcon Heavy.

    Hell, they obliterated a launchpad because btgey were dumb enough to not understand flame diverters…

    True but they were trying to launch a rocket that nobody else even tried to build. I would say it is fair that they make some mistakes.

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  • gandalf_der_12te@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    SpaceX? They got billions to get us to Mars. They never go beyond the super easy part in rocketry, low earth orbit.

    okay lol

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    • Cocodapuf@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      Actually, they have launched deep space NASA missions. The Europa clipper went to Jupiter on a falcon heavy just last year.

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      • gandalf_der_12te@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        yeah i know, that’s why i said “lol” :D

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