Comment on Hexbear federation megathread
blakeus12@hexbear.net 1 year agoSymbol of the Nazi party, famous for rounding up and systematically exterminating millions of jews, black people, leftists, anarchists, etc and attempting to conquer all of europe is exactly the same as the main symbol of an ideology which advocates for workers collectively owning the means of production?
I understand what you mean but the hammer and sickle is the symbol of communism, not belonging to one country. the hammer and sickle did not originate with what happened in estonia.
I understand what you mean but the hammer and sickle is the symbol of communism, not belonging to one country. the hammer and sickle did not originate with what happened in estonia.
and swastika did not originate in the nazi germany and yet here we are.
thank you for giving all of us illustration of that very kind of obfuscation of facts i was talking about. now sod off and stay on hexbear.
😠
Yet the hammer and sickle is just as atta hed to the USSR as the swastika is to nazis
wait u a trot
when the heck did we let trots on hexbear
Left unity means left unity
Left unity was always achieved after properly excluding elements both parties disagreed on. We are able to stay united on hexbear because we do not discuss some events in history where we weren’t so… united
Is hexbear not about left solidarity? I am a Trotskyist, yes. I believe in the permanent revolution, comrade Catradora
Sorry, hexbear didn’t have many trotskyists when I was more active a few months ago
although I disagree with you strongly, solidarity forever comrade blake
SchizoDenji@lemm.ee 1 year ago
Not to defend nazis, but are you really going to ignore the deaths under communism or how communist dictators persecuted people?
blakeus12@hexbear.net 1 year ago
every system has had deaths under it. for example, i could say: not to defend nazis, but are you really going to ignore the deaths under capitalism or the bodo league massacre, the vietnam war crimes, agent orange, the laos bombings, the civilian killings in iraq, the drone strikes that killed civilians all across the middle east, slavery, all of the deaths causes by poverty, etc.
Obviously it has happened under communism as well but nowhere near to the scale under capitalism (for the most part, see Pol Pot, the Red Terror, Holodomor)
alcoholicorn@hexbear.net 1 year ago
The fascist whose faction was put in power by the US, that was overthrown by Vietnamese communists? Whose gov’t-in-exile the US supported against the communist People’s Republic of Cambodia until 1993?
That’s some “hitler was a socialist”-level bs
Catradora_Stalinism@hexbear.net 1 year ago
what else do you expect from a trotskyist
ShimmeringKoi@hexbear.net 1 year ago
Just so you know comrade, there is no academic consensus even among western scholars that the '32 famine was anything more than a disaster, and certainly not a genocide. Mark Tauger has a great debunking of Anne Applebaum on the subject. So we do not, in fact, have to apologize for that.
ennemi@hexbear.net 1 year ago
Well, we either ignore deaths or we don’t. The United States of America ran the largest slave trade in history and nearly wiped out the native population of an entire continent, nuked two cities, overthrew countless democracies, and bankrolled/trained fascist and/or religious fundamentalist militias all over the world. This is all historical fact.
But it also represents one of the strongest cultures in history, as well historical advancements in science, technology, civics, etc. Just like the USSR. Whereas the Nazis only represent industrialized genocide, eugenics and fascist oppression, the Soviet Union and the USA represent both the good and bad of humanity in extreme amounts. Their evils can be denounced just as much as their successes can be celebrated, and more usefully both can and should be studied as opposed to completely discarded on weak ideological principles. That’s why they’re both admissible in civil discussion.
Civility@hexbear.net 1 year ago
😤
ennemi@hexbear.net 1 year ago
sowwy
PersnickityPenguin@lemm.ee 1 year ago
Small caveat: the United States dropped two nuclear weapons to end a fascist dictatorship in Japan that ran a war of oppression against over a billion people. Including countless warcrimes and crimes against humanity that killed millions of people in occupied countries.
TheOtherwise@hexbear.net 1 year ago
I think that point just reinforces your argument.
These bombs were at no point necessary to be used. The US murdered these people to show off a new weapon. I’m sorry, but this talking point is a product of how history as the general populace knows it having been shaped by US dominance. It has no actual basis in reality.
This is a perfect example of something that’s come up a few times here in this thread. People are saying ‘Oh, they’re so angry. They’re so angry.’ Well why is that? It’s because beliefs like these are so deeply ingrained within the culture of the US and the broader hegemonic core, and are so completely removed from reality, that it’s utterly tiresome being inundated by them day in and day out.
Catradora_Stalinism@hexbear.net 1 year ago
The soviet invasion of Manchuria which absolutely decimated the fascists army in less than a month is attributed by historians to be the far more likely cause of their surrender.