Policy banning vape sales outside of pharmacies to go before Senate, health minister says

Submitted ⁨⁨4⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago⁩ by ⁨Sarsaparilla@aussie.zone⁩ to ⁨australia@aussie.zone⁩

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LSJUCtyP2W8

What are people’s thoughts here? I could understand removing all the lolly flavours and regulating like other tobacco products. I am an ex-smoker but I personally feel like this is govt over-reach. That might be an out-dated mindset of my time & generation (genX), however. So I’m interested to get some insight into how the broader population view this issue, particularly the younger generations, in both an overall opinion, but also in regards to such govt controls of recreational substances vs an individual’s right of freedom to choose.

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zero_gravitas@aussie.zone ⁨4⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
Yeah, I don’t see why they shouldn’t be treated exactly like cigarettes.

From October that’ll pretty much be the case, except only purchasable at a pharmacy. I can’t see why they shouldn’t be sold at servos, etc., but I don’t think it’s a massive problem in terms of personal freedoms. It’ll give pharmacies a cash boost, and maybe even cause expansion of their opening hours in some cases, which could be helpful.

In any case, I think that the deal the Greens got is probably the best one Labor were ever going to give.

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- unionagainstdhmo@aussie.zone ⁨4⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  I’m not sure I understand the Greens position on vapes. Are they pro-tobacco or something? or is it about creating a black market?
  
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  - zero_gravitas@aussie.zone ⁨4⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    The Greens have always been against prohibition more broadly, but they can articulate their reasoning better than I can: …org.au/…/greens-secure-amendments-vaping-legisla…
    
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CurlyWurlies4All@slrpnk.net ⁨4⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
I don’t see them as any different to cigarettes personally. Just one more way for giant corporations to get people hooked on addictive shit with no upside. Fuck Jool. Fuck Philip Morris.

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- naevaTheRat@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨4⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  The giant corps are the ones massively involved in the black market :(
  
  It’s probably not realistic to say no upside, as people usually do stuff for reasons even if it’s terrible overall. Like a bizarrely high proportion of people with schitzophrenia take nicotine so there probably is something it’s doing that helps in the moment.
  
  There’s gonna be a market one way or the other. IMHO the government should step in to make it tightly controlled and low profit (if not nationalised). Also we should lynch everyone who’s ever taken a dollar of tobacco money but idk how broad support for that is.
  
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Fuck_The_Karlings@lemmy.world ⁨4⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
I’m a Millennial.

I found the idea of banning vapes to be pretty hypocritical of the government.

Like the idea that we don’t want children getting addicted to nicotine is a good goal to strive towards, However to ban the only source of nicotine dependence that doesn’t get taxed by the government while leaving cigarettes alone felt really dodgy to me.

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WhiteShotgun@aussie.zone ⁨4⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
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- unionagainstdhmo@aussie.zone ⁨4⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  Are you saying that vaping is a good thing and a net positive?
  
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- Sarsaparilla@aussie.zone ⁨4⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  I agree that it will further worsen the black market surrounding these products (just as the exorbitant ciggie tax has increased the illegal import of cigarettes that are not regulated.) A bunch of businesses will basically be shut down because of this … they can’t exactly pivot to something else. If they wanted to sell cigarettes they would have been doing so already.
  
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  - unionagainstdhmo@aussie.zone ⁨4⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    
    A bunch of businesses will basically be shut down because of this … they can’t exactly pivot to something else
    
    It’s a damn shame too - I don’t know what we’ll do without all those businesses built around exploiting drug addicts
    
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Outsider9042@lemmy.world ⁨4⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
As a non-smoker, I find vapes far less obnoxious in terms of odour.

The main problem I had with it all is the waste. Seeing cigarette butts and single use vape cartridge litter the streets makes me mad.

I’m a big fan of do what you want as long as you don’t make it my problem.

Ban cigarette filters, ban single use vapes. The rest I couldn’t care less about.

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- breadsmasher@lemmy.world ⁨4⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  
  Ban single use vapes
  
  I really hope this becomes a worldwide ban. Disposable vapes are hugely wasteful
  
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eatthecake@lemmy.world ⁨4⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
If prohibition doesn’t work then why ban vaping? If prohibition does work then why not ban smoking? The billions in tax money is why.

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Ilandar@aussie.zone ⁨4⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
Vaping becoming socially acceptable and widespread has been fucking annoying as an asthmatic, so I am please to see that we’re entering a period where the health risks are being better examined and governments are starting to regulate. Social policymaking is always difficult, but it’s a start and hopefully can be improved and refined in the future. A solution having potentially unintended consequences is not a reason to avoid attempting to solve the problem altogether. I also don’t buy this libertarian “any restriction of my freedom is bad” argument when the behaviour in question is anti-social and harmful.

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- naevaTheRat@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨4⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  The problem is this applies equally well to stuff like eating fast food or not doing cardio 3x a week.
  
  I’m an ex smoker for context, I hate this fucking shit but we don’t offer any real support to prevent addiction and just punish people for it.
  
  I’m 100% plain packaging and selling behind counter (for all drugs, all products really ought to have advertising bans and plain packaging but I’ll never win that one). I’m also in favour of making addicting stuff boring. But after that people are ultimately free to make bad choices (I write, sprawled with terrible posture, a glass of wine, and some chips) and leaving the TGA to authorise these will mean none get approved and a black market will be created anyway.
  
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  - Ilandar@aussie.zone ⁨4⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    
    The problem is this applies equally well to stuff like eating fast food or not doing cardio 3x a week.
    
    Neither of those behaviours have any direct impact on my health. Even alcoholics don’t directly affect the health of those around them by drinking in public.
    
    But after that people are ultimately free to make bad choices
    
    Vapers would still be free to make bad choices and hurt those around them under this new policy. No one is taking away vapes, just like no one took away cigarettes.
    
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- Nath@aussie.zone ⁨4⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  Is it worse than actual smoking, though?
  
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  - Sarsaparilla@aussie.zone ⁨4⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    
    A study measuring the aerosols from two vape users and comparing it with secondhand cigarette smoke found vapes produced a much lower level of ultrafine particles, but a much higher level of nanoparticles. It is not clear what risk these pose. Another study found vape use increased fine particles in a room’s air.
    
    From SMH: Is secondhand vaping a growing threat or ‘fake news’?
    
    It would seem the science is still not in on just how dangerous it is, but further in the article it says:
    
    The question, says Demaio, is whether we should wait for conclusive evidence before taking action.
    
    “We don’t have any long-term studies on the safety of these products, or on the safety of secondhand exposure. It took us 20 years to realise it [tobacco] was causing damage in the next generation of kids who were living with others who smoked.
    
    “My worry is we take another two or three decades to realise the same thing.”
    
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  - Ilandar@aussie.zone ⁨4⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    Not as far as I’m aware, but vapes can also contain different chemicals that may contribute towards different types of health conditions. More research is needed on the long-term effects I think (which can only come with time). One thing I have definitely noticed among people I know who vape and/or smoke is that the vaping is constant and done everywhere and anywhere, whereas smoking is far less common and will be something that people remove themselves from a group to do (outside and further away). Vapers are far less considerate of others and vape more because they believe it’s less harmful, which increases the level of harm. So in that sense, I think government policy is also important here to signal that vaping is not harmless so that we can start changing the culture around it like was done with smoking many decades ago.
    
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FmbyMF@lemmy.world ⁨4⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
I think now would be a great time to figure out how to 3d print them and profit.

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