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Comment on What is the actual point of a bra?

DessertStorms@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨3⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

A lot of replies here ignoring the obvious - patriarchy, religion, and capitalism.

There are plenty of examples of societies past and present, for the vast majority of the time humans existed probably, where breasts are free to exist as they are. The people those breasts are attached to do all manner of work and activities without hinderance, or chafed nipples. Just like those with flat chests do.

The reason that in (especially our western) modern world we are expected to wear bras has to do with puritanism, shame, control, and profiteering from all of the above.

Comfort is categorically not a priority of the billion dollar bra industry, the trillion dollar advertising industry, nor those who demand we wear them lest we “excite” their, or their son’s, urges or “distract” them from their important manly duties (and if we don’t, and they attack us, it’d be our fault for not being “modest” enough and “asking for it”).

When we have all been socialised with these demands and expectations for centuries, they become so deeply ingrained, it’s really hard to separate from our own free will, and yet ask any group of people who wear bras what the best part of the day is, and they’ll tell you it’s taking it off.

And to be clear - this isn’t a judgment of anyone who wears a bra, I wear an underwire once in a blue moon which I hate, but am usually in a sports bra because I feel more comfortable with everything held in place (and also have nosy neighbours I’m not that friendly with), it’s about questioning why I feel more comfortable that way, and how much of that is natural vs manufactured by a society that demands I keep everything held in place, and hidden (unless they’re “required” to sell something or entertain the mens).

Anyway, I’m stoned too and I tend to ramble, so I think I 'll leave it at that for now lol

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DarkThoughts@fedia.io ⁨3⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

A lot of replies here ignoring the obvious - patriarchy, religion, and capitalism.

They're not. OP is asking the actual point of them, and you're bringing modern politics into it, which are a very recent development. "Bras" go way back, like thousands of years BCE, all with very different functions.

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EABOD25@lemm.ee ⁨3⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
I mean no offense, but after all of the work women have done to get the rights and regards that they have today (don’t misunderstand me, there’s still work that can be done), and excuse my assumption, but it would be more or less the woman’s control of whether they would/should wear a bra, so the argument (I’m going to summarize to list to a single word. I mean no offense, but it’s my perception. Feel free to correct me if I’m wrong) of whether you should or shouldn’t is a feminist argument that feminist are the ones that argue about the most. However, I still believe “your body your right”. Do what you want.

However I had 2 ulterior motives for asking: 1) to actually know where and why bras were first used 2) the vast majority of people (cis, trans, straight, gay, men, and women) enjoy boobs. There are people on the planet that sexualize boobs, but boobs are a hot topic. People enjoy talking about boobs, and to me it’s a weird phenomenon. About the only exception I think to that rule would be gay men, but they can probably still appreciate a good pair of pups.

Again, I mean no offense. I just believe that some conversations about boobs are neither alienating or innapropriate. I hope I explained this in a way that isn’t creepy. If it does seem creep, please let me know and I’ll try to reword it

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- DessertStorms@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨3⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  
  A lot of replies here ignoring the obvious - patriarchy, religion, and capitalism.
  
  I’ll be honest, if you don’t have an understanding of how deeply these (along with white supremacy, cis heteronormativity, ablesim, classism) impact not only society at large, but our individual choices (or lack thereof), and it sounds like you don’t, I can’t really help at this point, there’s just too much to unpack and it’s not work I’m interested in doing for you.
  
  As for your ulterior motives - the first is easy to resolve by opening a search engine and looking it up, the second absolutely makes you sound like a creep, and also provides a perfect demonstration of the kind of external pressure we face that more often than not compels us to cover up - we feel you “appreciating” our “pups” (aka your “male gaze” or simply you objectifying us). And it’s fucking gross.
  
  Maybe you should read my first reply again, this time try and actually listen to the experience of a person explaining to you the pressures they and others like them face from society that you never have, instead of dismissing it, and then invest some of your own time actually researching the topic, not of why people wear bras, but of how fundamentally social constructs impact society and all the individuals in it, and maybe you’ll start to get an idea of what the actual answer to your question is.
  
  But I have a feeling you’re not interested in doing any of that, so I’ll just leave you with this - boobs don’t exist for you.
  
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  - EABOD25@lemm.ee ⁨3⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    Ok well, I haven’t attacked anyone and have made it clear that my own perceptions and beliefs could use some work. I haven’t used personal attacks. And I’m very interested in changing my perception… as long as those who perceive things differently are as respectful to me as I am to them.
    
    So now for you specifically, here’s the deal. Your first argument to my first ulterior motive is you proving you are self-righteous because I posted this on “No Stupid Questioms”. Which makes you the asshole in this regard while I’m truly trying to learn. Second, you are the first person to have such an issue with my asking. So there’s a great chance that my line of asking isn’t the problem, but it’s ypu that’s the problem
    
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