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Comment on Would America be as divided if Trump lost to Hillary in 2016?

VinesNFluff@pawb.social ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

Yes and no.

Without Trump fucking shit up on a government level (the Supreme Court in particular), there would probably be less scary shit happening on that end.

But the radicalisation of the Americans began before 2016. Trump is a symptom, not a cause. The disease started spreading as early as 2008.

That’s the thing people don’t realise. Even if Donald J. Trump didn’t exist, the underlying social tensions mean that inevitably someone would show up to galvanise far right sentiments, and the political estabilishment would have boosted them, whoever they were, because when the common folk are getting angry about their lot, then to the people actually in charge, a fascist dictatorship is preferrable to the alternative.

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HelixDab2@lemm.ee ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
No, it started with Nixon, and his Southern Strategy. Reagan and the Silent Majority–which was fundamentally about racism and the desire to segregate schools, even though abortion was their cause célèbre–made it worse. And Newt Gingritch and the “Contract With America” really threw gasoline on the fire.

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- VinesNFluff@pawb.social ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  I mean if you wanna dive that deep, it started when some religious extremists got kicked out of England for being too extremist (for the british empire!) and moved to the new world, killing the people who previously lived there.
  
  … But up until 2008 shit more or less held together? Not pretending 'murica was ever good, but it was the 2008 recession that caused its structure, however fucky it had been from first principles, to really break down.
  
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  - HelixDab2@lemm.ee ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    The modern far-right really got it’s first big taste of legitimacy with the Tea Party. Which, yes, would be 2009-ish, and a blood-relative to the election of Obama. (E.g., without Obama as president, the racist fears of the Tea Party would have fizzled out in the harsh light of reality.) But I look at all of this on a continuum; the only two conservatives I see in recent memory that have made an apparently sincere attempt to stop the crazy train have been John McCain (…although he took Palin as a running mate…) and Mitt Romney, and they both got crushed by Dems. Well, maybe Liz Cheney too. Maybe. But she was okay with everything except Trump, so I dunno. Anyway, point is - Nixon, Reagan, and Gingritch were all laying the foundations and drawing up the architectural plans that Trump has used, and is using now, to build his version of a fascist state.
    
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    Asafum@feddit.nl ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    
    The modern far-right really got it’s first big taste of legitimacy with the Tea Party
    
    Thanks a bunch Koch brother (still quite happy at least one of them is dead.)
    
    That is entirely an astroturfed “caucus” along with the freedumb caucus… Bought and paid for by the ownership class. Ever wonder why those assholes never go away no matter how horrible they are? They’re the Koch’s henchmen…
    
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CoggyMcFee@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
I think that electing someone as deranged as Trump — who basically would try anything and everything that a sane person wouldn’t risk out of self-preservation, we basically saw a speedrun of finding out all the weaknesses and exploits of our government, combined with proving that impeachment and removal is basically impossible as long as one party is in collusion with the president.

We might have gotten here anyway, but it might have been a decade or two rather than four short years.

And the Supreme Court wouldn’t look like it does and be doing what’s it’s doing, which is also now a speedrun of horror.

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- Myro@lemm.ee ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  Yeah. Pushing for nearly immunity of the president might turn out to be very costly when someone actually reckless comes to presidency. And I presume Trump will be a version of that someone, as he is getting old and there won’t be another term for him. Nothing to lose, all to gain. He will make th US a shit show.
  
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