why are you stuck with their questionable open-source and ass of a kernel
Because you don’t care about it being open source? Just working (and continuing to work) is a pretty big motivating factor to stay with what you have.
Comment on Broadcom yanks ESXi Free version, effective immediately
TCB13@lemmy.world 10 months agoIf you’re already using LXC containers why are you stuck with their questionable open-source and ass of a kernel when you can just run LXD/Incus and have a much cleaner experience in a pure Debian system? Boots way faster, fails less and is more open.
fuckwit_mcbumcrumble@lemmy.world 10 months ago
TCB13@lemmy.world 10 months ago
Because you don’t care about it being open source?
If you’re okay with the risk of one day ending up like the people running ESXi now then you should be okay. Let’s say that not “ending up with your d* in your hand” when you least expect it is also a pretty big motivating factor to move away from Proxmox.
Now I don’t see how come in a self-hosting community on Lemmy someone would bluntly state what you’ve.
fuckwit_mcbumcrumble@lemmy.world 10 months ago
What makes you think that can’t happen to something just because it’s open source?
It’s “Selfhosted” not “SelfHostedOpenSourceFreeAsInFreedom/GNU”. Not everyone has drank the entire open source punch bowl.
TCB13@lemmy.world 10 months ago
What makes you think that can’t happen to something just because it’s open source? And from all companies it’s from Canonical.
It was from Canonical and I’m was never suggesting you run LXC/LXD from Canonical’s repos. The solution is available on Debian’s repositories and besides LXD was forked into Incus by the people who originally made LXC/LXD while working at Canonical that now work full time on the Incus project / keeping the solution truly open.
It’s “Selfhosted” not “SelfHostedOpenSourceFreeAsInFreedom/GNU”. Not everyone has drank the entire open source punch bowl.
Dude, I use Windows and a ton of proprietary software, I’m certainty not Richard Stallman. I simply used Proxmox for a VERY LONG time professionally and at home and migrated everything gradually to LXD/Incus and it performs a LOT better. Being truly open-source and not a potential CentOS/ESXi also helps.
DeltaTangoLima@reddrefuge.com 10 months ago
I’m intrigued, as your recent comment history keeps taking aim at Proxmox. What did you find questionable about them? My servers boot just fine, and I haven’t had any failures.
I’m not uninterested in genuinely better alternatives, but I don’t have a compelling reason to go to the level of effort required to replace Proxmox.
TCB13@lemmy.world 10 months ago
Here’s the thing, I run Promox since 2009 until the end of last year professionally in datacenters, multiple clusters around 10-15 nodes each. I’ve been around for all wins and fails of Proxmox, I’ve seen the raise and fall of OpenVZ, all the SLES/RHEL compatibility issues and then them moving to LXC containers.
While it worked most of the time and their payed support was decent I would never recommend it to anyone since LXD/Incus became a thing. The Promox PVE kernel has a lot of quirks and hacks. Besides the fact that is build upon Ubuntu’s kernel that is already a dumpster fire of hacks (waiting someone upstream to implement things properly so they can backported them and ditch their implementation) they add even more garbage over it. I’ve been burned countless times by their kernel when it comes to drivers, having to wait months for fixes already available upstream or so they would fix their own shit after they introduced bugs.
At some point not even simples things such as OVPN worked fine under Proxmox’s kernel. Realtek networking was probably broken more times than working, ZFS support was introduced with guaranteed kernel panic and upgrading between versions was always a shot in the dark and half of the time you would get a half broken system that is able to boot and pass a few tests but that will randomly fail a few days later. Their startup is slow, slower than any other solution - it even includes daemons that are there just to ensure that other things are running (because most of them don’t even start with the system properly on the first try).
Proxmox is considerably cheaper than ESXi so people use it in some businesses like we did, but far from perfect. Eventually Canonical invested in LXC and a very good and much better than OpenVZ and co. container solution was born. LXC got stable and widely used and LXD came with the hypervisor higher level management, networking, clustering etc. and since we now have all that code truly open-source and the creators of it working on the project without Canonicals influence.
There’s no reason to keep using Proxmox as LXC/LXD got really good in the last few years. Once you’re already running on LXC containers why keep using and dragging all the Proxmox bloat and potencial issues when you can use LXD/Incus made by the same people who made LXC that is WAY faster, stable, more integrated and truly open-source?
Well if you’re some time to spare on testing stuff try LXD/Incus and you’ll see. Maybe you won’t replace all your Proxmox instances but you’ll run a mixed environment like a did for a long time.
DeltaTangoLima@reddrefuge.com 10 months ago
OK, I can definitely see how your professional experiences as described would lead to this amount of distrust. I work in data centres myself, so I have plenty of war stories of my own about some of the crap we’ve been forced to work with.
But, for my self-hosted needs, Proxmox has been an absolute boon for me (I moved to it from a pure RasPi/Docker setup about a year ago).
I’m interested in have a play with LXD/Incus, but that’ll mean either finding a spare server to try it on, or unpicking a Proxmox node to do it. The former requires investment, and the latter is pretty much a one-way decision (at least, not an easy one to rollback from).
Something I need to ponder…
TCB13@lemmy.world 10 months ago
It’s not just the level of distrust, is the fact that we eventually moved all those nodes to LXD/Incus and the amount of random issues in day to day operations dropped to almost zero. LXD/Incus covers the same ground feature-wise (with a very few exceptions that frankly didn’t also work properly under Proxmox) and performs better under the continuous high loads you expect on a datacenter.
When it performs that well on the extreme case, why not use for self-hosting as well? :)
Well you can always virtualize under a Proxmox node so you get familiar with it ahaha
MigratingtoLemmy@lemmy.world 10 months ago
XCP-ng it is for you sir