Comment on American automakers are losing the race to make more fuel-efficient vehicles

• AA5B@lemmy.world ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  This consumer made that decision because the Model 3 has a tiny triangular door that is frustrating for tall people to use, plus I want to give my teenagers room to be comfortable in the back seat. It’s reasonable to upgrade from a car that “seats 5” legally to one that actually seats your family comfortably.

  I understand that to some of you I’m part of the problem, but I see an awful lot of single people commuting to offices in trucks and full sized SUVs, so I like to think that’s different

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  • helenslunch@feddit.nl ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    This consumer made that decision because the Model 3 has a tiny triangular door

    …what? It’s a very typical door, I’m not sure what you mean.

    It’s reasonable to upgrade from a car that “seats 5” legally to one that actually seats your family comfortably.

    No one said it was unreasonable. And I don’t blame anyone for not riding bikes or walking to work every day. It’s very difficult to “go green” while some people who don’t give a single fuck consume more in a week than you or I will in a lifetime. It all just feels very fruitless.

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  • TheGrandNagus@lemmy.world ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    I don’t see how the door on a Model 3 is tiny? I’ve been in my friend’s, as well as in countless taxis, and never had an issue, just seems like a normal size/shape door to me.

    I doubt it’d be used so extensively for taxis if it was difficult to get in/out of.

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    • AA5B@lemmy.world ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      • I’ve never seen it as a taxi
      • the pillar is too far forward, so us talker people need to maneuver in and back. However it’s too narrow to bend a little at the waist to get in, so I need an extra joint in the middle of my back. Usually I make do by jamming my head against the car frame to force my neck to bend down to my shoulder. Not fun

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• Rivalarrival@lemmy.today ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  I do not deny that a segment of consumers want large cars. I, myself, have need for a 9+ passenger vehicle with a >10,000lb tow rating. A modern Suburban is actually too small to meet the needs of my summer and daytime business, which involves hauling customers and equipment across the county. But, I still have plenty of options on the market for that large vehicle.

  But, my winter and nighttime business calls for a very small, very lightweight vehicle. 30-year-old subcompact designs are more fuel efficient and suitable for couriers (DoorDash, GrubHub, etc.) than anything currently being manufactured. I can’t buy a new subcompact vehicle: there is nothing currently on the market that ideally meets my business needs.

  The closest I can find in terms of ideal size and weight would be a Japanese Kei truck, but maintenance would be a nightmare.

  You are not getting an accurate picture of consumer preference, because the segment of the consumer base demanding small vehicles is not having its needs met.

  Also, obligatory “Fuck Tesla”. Fuck their lack of door handles. Fuck their lack of buttons. Fuck their touchscreens. Fuck their quality and workmanship. And triple fuck the politics of their CEO.

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  • helenslunch@feddit.nl ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    You are not getting an accurate picture of consumer preference, because the segment of the consumer base demanding small vehicles is not having its needs met.

    There are way more than enough small vehicles to choose from. You’re just wrong on this one.

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    • Rivalarrival@lemmy.today ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Nothing as small as was common in the 90’s. Regulatory standards and manufacturer preference - not consumer demand - is forcing vehicles to be larger.

      You can’t even get an S10 or Ranger sized pickup anymore.

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      • helenslunch@feddit.nl ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        Nothing as small as was common in the 90’s.

        Sure we do. Ever seen a Smart car? A Mini? Honda Fit? Chevy Spark? Mazda 2? etc.

        Regulatory standards and manufacturer preference - not consumer demand - is forcing vehicles to be larger.

        It’s all of the above.

        What regulatory standards are preventing more manufacturers from selling sedans and hatchbacks?

        You can’t even get an S10 or Ranger sized pickup anymore.

        Sure you can. Look up Ford Maverick.

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  • Buelldozer@lemmy.today ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    I can’t buy a new subcompact vehicle: there is nothing currently on the market that ideally meets my business needs.

    I’m curious what kind of “business need” you have that could be met by a subcompact from 30 years ago but NOT by a Chevy Bolt or Chevy EUV? Either of those have an mpge rating of more than DOUBLE what an old Honda Civic Hatchback or Kei truck could manage plus more cargo space than either of them! The Bolt’s are fairly inexpensive too, 2020 models can be bought used for less than $18,000 and 2017s for less than $14,000.

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    • Rivalarrival@lemmy.today ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      “More cargo space” is the battle cry of the “bigger is better” crowd, so I reject that argument outright.

      Yes, the bolt has better economy. But, the 1990 Honda Civic was 20 inches shorter and 4 inches narrower. An updated Honda Civic with an equivalent drivetrain as the bolt would be smaller and lighter, and thus be getting even better mileage than the bolt.

      Those extra 20 inches in length and 4 inches in width are necessary for the bolt to meet modern emissions standards. Shorten it by 20 inches and narrow it by 4, and Chevy wouldn’t be allowed to produce it, even though it would have a higher economy.

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      • Buelldozer@lemmy.today ⁨9⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        “More cargo space” is the battle cry of the “bigger is better” crowd, so I reject that argument outright.

        Then I reject your consideration of a Kei Truck as cargo space obviously isn’t a concern for you.

        But, the 1990 Honda Civic was 20 inches shorter and 4 inches narrower. An updated Honda Civic with an equivalent drivetrain as the bolt would be smaller and lighter…

        Unrealistic as it could not be sold. A 1990 Honda Civic lacks crumple zones and other safety features that are now required on vehicles in the United States.

        …and thus be getting even better mileage than the bolt.

        Nope, the additional safety features make the footprint lager and the vehicle heavier.

        Those extra 20 inches in length and 4 inches in width are necessary for the bolt to meet modern emissions standards.

        Sigh, the Bolt doesn’t HAVE any emissions. It’s a straight EV. The extra size over a 1990 Honda Civic are for the required safety features and drivetrain.

        Yes, the bolt has better economy.

        So what’s the problem? A domestic auto manufacturer DOES in fact make something that would work and that something is superior in every way to a sub-compact from 30 years ago. Go buy one.

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