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• tekila@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Ok let me unpack your two points:

  • The difference with the sentience criteria is that a non-sentient being by definition cannot be hurt by actions taken against their being as there is quite literally no subject, no one, to experience anything. Would you say that someones that likes smashing rocks is discriminating against rocks? Of course not because it makes no sense to speak about discrimination for a non sentient being/object. The only time where you can make an argument that doing something to a non sentient being is an issue is when it affects a sentient being.

  • Again as I’ve literally stated in my earlier comment the discrimination is not based on species but on sentience. If you want a more concrete example, let’s imagine a philosophical zombie or in other terms a non-sentient human. I would not include such a being in my moral circle by itself as it would lack sentience.

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  • commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    as I’ve literally stated in my earlier comment the discrimination is not based on species but on sentience

    you don’t seem to understand that you have decided, for instance, oak trees do not have sentience, and you treat all oak trees as though they are the same due to their membership in the class “oak tree” instead of treating them as individuals. it’s speciesism. and, in fact, you do this to sentient animals too, classing them all together and setting a standard to treat them based on their class membership. it’s speciesism. it’s just speciesism you agree with.

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  • commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    The only time where you can make an argument that doing something to a non sentient being is an issue is when it affects a sentient being.

    consequentialism is fraught with epistemic problems. how can you know what might effect a sentient being at some point in the future?

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  • commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    it makes no sense to speak about discrimination for a non sentient being/object.

    we discriminate between cars and motorcycles.

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  • commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Would you say that someones that likes smashing rocks is discriminating against rocks?

    i wouldn’t say they’re are discriminating against rocks. i’d say they are using discrimination and allowing themselves to smash objects they class as “rocks”

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    • tekila@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      But you would agree that the rocks themselves cannot have an issue with it? That’s the gist of the sentientist position. Sentient beings have an interest in living, not being exploited and thus the sentientist position goes further and say that for the same reasons we say that humans have a right to live (i.e.: not being killed) or being exploited, we should extend the same rights to sentient beings because there is no morally relevant difference between us and other sentient beings that would justify killing them when you would not kill a human being in the same position.

      Note that this does not mean all sentient beings should have exactly the same rights. Obviously giving the right to vote to a cow does not make sense, the same way we don’t give the right to abortion to cis men because they cannot make use of this right.

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      • commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        we say that humans have a right

        i don’t. rights are a fiction.

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      • commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        we should extend the same rights to sentient beings because there is no morally relevant difference between us and other sentient beings

        yes there is.

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      • commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        But you would agree that the rocks themselves cannot have an issue with it?

        yea. it doesn’t change whether you’re practicing discrimination.

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