Comment on What can US citizens do to fight/prevent their country enabling genocide?

• delusion@lemmy.myserv.one ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  How the US is enabling it: Sending money, weapons, intellegence etc to the Israels military. The US is actively enabling the operations of the IDF, this is obvious and I do not think that anyone claims anything different. The US denies that a genocide is being commited, but they do not deny that they greatly help the IDF.

  Why the operations of the IDF is considered genocide: See: un.org/…/un-special-committee-press-release-19nov… or en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaza_genocide

  Side note regarding sources and integrity of information: Do you believe that Israel is mounting a large intentional disinformation/propaganda campaign towards western countries? Or do you not believe any such thing? And do you live in the US?

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  • FreedomAdvocate@lemmy.net.au ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    The position that what Israel are doing is a genocide is the sticking point, and one that is highly contested. I don’t believe that what they’re doing is, because they’re not trying to erase an entire national or ethnic group - just Hamas.

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    • delusion@lemmy.myserv.one ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      I see that this is the common point of view for people who sympathise with Israel. I strongly disagree with you but appreciate you wanting to discuss it.

      It seems you belive you have to be convinced of to things in order to change your view: A. Genocidal acts are being commited. B. The genocidal acts are being commited with genocidal intent.

      A: That genocidal acts are being committed is a fact. Carefully read through the wikipedia article above (en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaza_genocide) if you’re not convinced. Do it. Read the article.

      B: You seem to focus on this. i.e that the actions taken by IDF are only powered by a will to protect the security of Israel, and that there is no intent of genocide. I don’t necessarily agree, but let’s say you’re right: Israel only does what it does out of security concerns. This does not warrant the genocidal actions commited. You can’t, out of security concerns, kill 10,000 children. This should be obvious.

      Please reconsider your views.

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      • FreedomAdvocate@lemmy.net.au ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        “Genocidal acts” doesn’t mean that a genocide is happening. “Destruction of civilian infrastructure” is an “act of genocide”. That happens in almost every conflict in the world, and not every one is a genocide.

        A genocide is a specific thing. For me to be convinced that there is a genocide happening, specific things need to happen and with a specific intent - and those things aren’t happening in Gaza. Hamas want a genocide. They’re very open about this. Israel are trying to eliminate Hamas. If Hamas surrendered, the killing would stop.

        Unfortunately in war there are casualties. Casualties will be increased when one of the parties at war - Hamas - use civilians, including kids, as “meat shields”, like putting their military bases in schools and hospitals as Hamas has been factually proven to do. Hamas have been caught faking civilian deaths and casualty numbers too, and they’re an internationally recognised terrorist organisation - they are not to be trusted, no matter what you think of Israel. Again - Hamas openly call for the genocide of Jews and Israelis. Very openly.

        A question for you - if you were to agree that Israel are doing what they are doing in retaliation to what Hamas did on October 7, and will not stop until Hamas are defeated, would you still consider that a genocide? If Hamas surrendered and Israel stopped killing Palestinians, would you still say it was a genocide?

        Another question - are you open to reconsidering your views? Or are you steadfast in them but expect me to consider changing mine?

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