Comment on Ditching the VPN and port forwarding the selfhosted way

EmbarrassedDrum@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

• Schlemmy@lemmy.ml ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  I’ve set up some tunnels. Works nice but then the voices came. ‘Why would you trust a company like Cloudflare with all your data?’ ‘Why rely on this one company for all your services?’

  Nearly a year into my selfhosting journey and I’m more confused than ever.

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  • EmbarrassedDrum@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    tl;dr: classic convenience/privacy. depends on your threat model. surely better than Google. models of zero trust will help.

    That’s a great question, that I have asked myself before too. It doesn’t have one answer, and any one would make their own choices based on their own respective threat model. I’ll answer you with some of my thoughts, and why I do use their services.

    I’ll take as an example my usage of NextCloud, coming as a replacement to Google Drive for example.

    let’s break up the setups:

    1. client (mobile app, desktop client, browser)
    2. communication to server
    3. server

    It’s oversimplified, but to the point: In Google’s setup, you have control of 0 out of three things.

    1. you use their closed source client, 2. they decide the communication to the server (if there’s any CDN, where their servers located, TLS version), and 3. data is on their servers, wether encrypted or not is up to them.

    In NextCloud’s setup,

    1. The clients are open source (you can varify them, or build your own),
    2. communication to server is up to you. and in this case you trust your data with CF, that’s right. gonna have to trust them.
    3. server is your server, and you encrypt the files how you want.

    From just this look, NC is clearly better off. now, it’s not perfect, and each one will do their own convenience vs privacy deal and decide their deal.

    If you deploy some sort of e2ee, the severity level of CF drops even more, because they’re exposed to less data. specifically for NC they do do e2ee, but each solution to its own. nextcloud.com/encryption/ this goes as an example for zero trust model. if you handle the encryption yourself (like using an e2ee service), you don’t have to trust the medium your data is going through. like the open internet.

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    • fmstrat@lemmy.nowsci.com ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      surely better than Google

      This contradicts your threat model comment, though. If you fear Google’s access to your data, you fear nation states, or hate Google. Cloudflare is in the same boat for size, scope, and US ownership.

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      • EmbarrassedDrum@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        Obviously I’m not avoiding it all together, but I’m taking a step in the right direction.

        And it’s not just replacing Google by CF, because CF has much less access in comparison as I explain.

        you can deploy some zero trust models in your setup, and eliminate the threat even further. for example end to end encryption

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    • Schlemmy@lemmy.ml ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Thanks. I agree with your conclusion. I probably have spent too much time in privacy communities. In the end you’ll have to trust someone.

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      • EmbarrassedDrum@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        that’s not to wear off of the importance of awareness. you should be aware always, even if you don’t take action.

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• ntn888@lemmy.ml ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Yeah it’s a popular choice for various things. But wouldn’t it be against TOS using it for p2p and that amount of traffic?

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  • EmbarrassedDrum@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    gotta admit I haven’t read the ToS, but I didn’t encounter any problems. I’m streaming GBs of music via the tunnel and it still works. p2p I didn’t try, but I don’t really see a reason to?

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    • asap@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Just remember that Cloudflare decrypts and re-encrypts all your data, so they can read absolutely everything that passes through those tunnels.

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      • EmbarrassedDrum@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        mind elaborating?

        If I let them handle the TLS for me then I can see that. but if, for example, I’m using NextCloud, which implement end to end encryption from client to server, then I wouldn’t care if they did, no?

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    • ntn888@lemmy.ml ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Huh, good to know. I’m out remember some of us have traffic in the TBs pretty month!

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