Comment on I'll share a troubling fact with you if you share one with me
eightpix@lemmy.world 3 weeks agoI’d read that David Brin reviewed something similar in '83, but I didn’t chase it down to Saberhagen.
In following the links provided in the Wiki article, for the Berserker Hypothesis, there is the following:
The Berserker hypothesis is distinct from the dark forest hypothesis in that under the latter, many alien civilizations could still exist provided they keep silent. The dark forest hypothesis can be viewed as a special case of the Berserker hypothesis, if the ‘deadly Berserker probes’ are (e.g. due to resource scarcity) only sent to star systems that show signs of intelligent life.
So, silence is survival in the Dark Forest. The Berserker Hypothesis seeks and destroys.
And, for my part, Cixin Liu’s second book was a really solid read. The first book, Three Body Problem, suffered all of the hallmarks of the pains taken to establish a story and a world. The last book, Death’s End, while mostly good, also suffered in needing to bring the grand story to a close.
ikidd@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
We’re going to have to disagree on those books. I found the first one amateurish and hand-wavy SF with terrible character development, and the second one was just a ridiculous deus-ex-machina plot point that invalidated all the rest of the previous and possible future plot pivot points, with continued terrible character development. I wouldn’t know about the third, by this point I was done giving him any more of my money.
I’m surprised about Brin’s article there, because all his work has been pretty upbeat about galactic species generally getting along, though with its rough points.
Personally, I chalk up the great silence to very short species lifespans after achieving spaceflight. Maybe they all go post-singularity and become undetectable, or run out of resources and go primitive again. Or just die off/suicide, which seems like where we’re headed. If we have a century of relatively powerful transmissions, what’s the chance of anyone being close enough in that short period of time to detect us?
eightpix@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
I guess we are going to have to disagree. The writing style and, as I perceived it, motivations within the text were clearly not of the Western tradition. It’s true, in lending the benefit of doubt, I may have enjoyed it more precisely because I disregarded standard writing mores, tropes, and conventions because it was a translated work.
I’m curious: Did you also try Murakami’s 1Q84? I found that I had to suspend expectations there in much the same manner.
I think I’d agree with you wrt. short species lifespans after developing telecommunications, space flight, and highly concentrated energy sources. The leap in capacity for attendant social distortion — and extortion — has brought us to the brink of global destruction many times since Signal Hill in 1901. The Kardashev Scale comes to mind here. The leap from about Type 0.73, ostensibly where we are now, to Type 1.0 is fraught.
As for the communications we have sent, the early ones were low-power and, over a distance of 100 ly, would significantly degrade against background EM radiation. At a range of 50 ly, where our first, more powerful and higher fidelity digital transmissions have reached, there are relatively few star systems — about 1300 (source). This source uses data from 1991, so there may be more, but not many, that are magnitude 6.5 or brighter.
ikidd@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
1Q84: never ran across it, but from the wikipedia article:
Which is pretty much where I was with TBP, so I can’t imagine I’ll rush out to read this.
Regarding translation: www.reddit.com/r/books/comments/…/izxm5l2/
I’ve read other chinese authors translated by the likes of Ken Liu and I see nothing like that, enjoy them well enough, before and after reading TBP. So the usual “your closed western mind can’t conceive of the Chinese style” argument kinda pisses me off when I get it back in discussions of these books. But I’m used to that reaction, so I don’t take it personally anymore.
Yah, I was thinking of the attenuation issue there, and not to mention that eventually the powerful transmissions go away in order to use low-power, high-bandwidth satellite bouncing instead of blaring away at 1kW to communicate. I imagine we’re already much quieter than we were 20 years ago.
eightpix@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
No accusation intended. Related my experience and seeking yours. Thanks for sharing what you have read about it.
Then, help me out if you feel inclined. Point me in the direction of some solid sci-fi, written in another language, with good translation to English. I’m always looking for the next read. I could Google it. But, instead, I’m looking for a recommendation from a strong critical eye. As guidance, I’m a pretty big fan of space epics, political intrigue, and/or social
Also, thanks for the language on attenuation. I’ve done a bit more reading on it, and I’ve seen the math. What I’ve learned is that most regulated radio transmissions in the Western hemisphere are capped at 50 kW. There are several transmitters that are in the 150 kW range, and, back in the 30s, there was that one titanic tower in Florida that kicked out 500 000 kW.