MolotovHalfEmpty
@MolotovHalfEmpty@hexbear.net
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
This. It was basically a ‘we’re not going to dignify that with an answer’ shorthand for abusive or obviously trolling posts.
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
Same old ahistorical buzzword nonsense. Even if anyone took your false equivalence seriously, how do you explain the secret police and concentration camps of all those ‘liberal’ nations? Or do you only scream unsupported accusations of fascism at people you disagree with as a cheap tactic to try and silence them?
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
Your dismissal and slandering of one of the single biggest LGBTQ+ communities online as lying about who they are as some sort of elaborate ploy by right wing trolls is really, really fucking disgusting and we’d rightly ban you on Hexbear for it.
Where were you for three years whilst those users and mods advocated, educated, and unfortunately suffered abuse in the process (from people we thankfully and rightly purged) of building one of the most LGBTQ+ places on the internet? Or the mutual aid our communities have done to help LGBTQ+ members overcome houseless, or not have to skip meals, or when those users have helped trans comrades find get access to healthcare and the medicine they need while living in hostile places?
I don’t doubt and I hope we continue to improve even further, and I don’t claim these achievements as my own, but your assumption is gross and shouldn’t be accepted - never mind left uncorrected.
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
pro fascism posts
This is just an outright lie. We’re an explicitly anti-fascist instance, have the strictest rules against bigotry I’ve seen anywhere on the internet, and the following is one of the core tenants of our culture and code of conduct:
We do not platform fascists and refuse to engage in any form of debate with them on this platform.
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
But it’s not like they invited Russia to invade.
That’s not the the case in any war and I’ve given a (admittedly very simple, broad strokes) overview of some of the material conditions that led to the war, even just in Ukraine - particularly the predominantly Russian speaking separatist regions wanting security guarantees after 8 years of being shelled by the Ukrainian coup government and terror attacks by neo-nazi militias that they state either couldn’t or wouldn’t reign in.
I think their ideology is blinding them into creating such a narrative. Not saying the US doesn’t meddle in other countries but this is really far fetched and just assumes that Russia is blameless
Hexbear doesn’t have a single ideology. It’s a left unity instance that had a broad range of anti-capitalist and anti-imperialist ideologies.
Nothing I’ve stated is far fetched, but all documented fact that a cursory reading of post-soviet history would support but if you like and are interested I can provide you some sources and reading?
No one on Hexbear thinks Russia is blameless. Views on Hexbear range from ‘this war is a travesty’ to ‘this war is a tragedy that could have been avoided by taking dozens of different decisions over the last two decades’. Again, I can give you some further examples and reading if you’re interested. But you claimed Hexbear users blamed Ukraine for the war and I said that “if there is a dominant view on Hexbear it’s that the biggest responsibility for the conflict lies with the US” for contributing most to the material conditions that eventually made a conflict like this sadly inevitable. But that doesn’t get Russia off the hook for also being a capitalist state also waging war and no one has stated that other countries don’t have their own agendas.
Not 100% sure what this means but I’m guessing it’s in regards to NATO.
Yes, NATO encirclement is part of it and was warned about by everyone from hawks like Henry Kissinger to former heads of NATO to Joe Biden himself before they went and did it anyway, but there’s also other aspects like the stationing of nuclear weapons, construction of new military bases, as well as coups, proxy wars, and funding destabilising groups on Russia’s borders.
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
There’s plenty of implicit calls for violence on that sub, they dug for a specific example to use as an excuse because of their political stance, and that example was basically the equivalent of someone saying ‘Eat The Rich’ by a user with no power to do anything about it. I don’t think anyone thinks actionable threats and comments like that are analogous, but even if they do, surely all promotion of violence is objectionable or none is.
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
You added that rationalization ten hours later and still compared us to Nazis.
Views on capital punishment vary across Hexbear, but in general I’d argue we’re generally anti. The idea we’re a pro-police brutality sub is absurd, given that ACAB and the police being the violent oppressive shock troops of capital are one of the the only views that’s basically agreed upon across Hexbear.
You seem to be misrepresenting the fact that while most communists (and not all of our users are communists) dislike, but understand the sad necessity of some degree of state violence in order to protect itself from hostile forces like coups and terrorism. All states believe this, it’s known as ‘the monopoly on violence’ but communists broadly want to achieve global revolution in order to move past the need for the destructive elements of the state (although I admit this is a pretty utopian, very long term goal). I’d be happy to send you some reading or video lectures on the subject if you’d like, but it sounds like you’re not interested.
And just a note in case you do pop over to Hexbear in the future, the disengagement rule we have isn’t a tool to send a long post and have the final word. But I’m also not interested in hounding you if you just want to move on. Hope you enjoy the rest of your day.
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
No problem. Hope to see you in the future!
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
I just went and checked. That rationale was based on one tongue in cheek ‘execute the landlords’ type comment in response to thr speculative housing market making Toronto unaffordable to live.
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
Why are you spamming the same comment (calling Hexbear users abusers, a gross and offensive comment to victims of abuse) again and again?
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
A lot of Hexbear users are well versed in political theory and philosophy and to some degree the instance serve as a big reading group (as well as fun, hobbies, and shitposting) so I can definitely see how that could be a bit intimidating to stumble into. But in general people are passionate about sharing information, books, articles etc so if you’re unsure of anything just ask for an explanation and you’ll find plenty of people eager to help.
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
I believe we were preemptively defederated from by those instances, with a common rationale being that we weren’t pro-NATO.
As for the rules being new in response to federation, you seem to be complaining that we’re doing exactly what you asked us to do above.
I suspect there’s no behaviour or amount of effort you’d accept. If that’s the case you should just say so.
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
Both sides in a war are responsible for bloodshed, but if there is a dominant view on Hexbear it’s that the biggest responsibility for the conflict lies with the US who created the modern Russian state, strung it along, then encircled it and escalated against all advice, backed the 2014 coup and the far right militias that carried out an 8 year civil war, continue fuelling the war for profit, and have sabotaged any attempt at peace talks. There are plenty of posts and even an official statement making this clear.
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
This is at least a two way street. People from Hexbear have a right to defend themselves when you call them Nazis and compare them to ISIS like you have elsewhere in this thread.
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
Can you explain what the difference is between ‘brigading’ and just users posting? How can a community that’s been the or one of the most active for over 3 years when it wasn’t federeated or connected with anyone, be a “spam instance”?
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
It was just a simple way to demonstrate to the people reading, that your concerns about Hexbear users acting in good faith were obviously nonsense, since the tone of all your posts have been… well… exactly like the one you just made.
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
I haven’t seen hexbear ever participate in good faith outside of this very thread.
You have a cool art comm here I’ve been posting in. I posted a pretty wild George Grosz painting you might like.
As for good faith commenting outside this thread, how about these…?
All the Chinese people in China who I totally really know in real life for sure. Those Chinese people in China that I totally really know all say they love love Xi. It’s totally because they really really want to and not because dissent isn’t allowed. They totally didn’t start making grade schoolers go to several extra hours of school a day to learn to worship Xi 2 years ago btw. Also there is no air pollution in Beijing. Did I mention I totally know some Chinese people. You’re all a bunch of sheltered white libs…not like me. I mean yeah, I am a lib, only 15, white, and I do live in my parents basement…but I know things, things that you don’t. There’s no way other people have any experience of the world so you have to believe, because I pretend…I mean DO, I do know some Chinese people in China and they are Chinese. They totally love their Chinese life in China where everyone has 120% literacy rate and reads 5 astrophysics books on their way to work in Beijing where there’s no air pollution in China.
You sound just like every other idiot that says that. Trumpers, anti-vaxxers and the like. If you have to look around for yOur Own rEsEaRcH that lines up with what you want it to say, it’s because it’s not based in facts. You guys seem to honestly think you sound smart…smh
They’re running around spewing barely-sensical insults acting like they’re dunking on people, but all their really doing is turning off anyone who was ever possibly sympathetic to their cause. And are completely un-informed on top of that
They’re laughable.
Anyone with half a brain can see what’s going on. I’m not playing these silly obfuscation games. You’re bad at what you do.
No it’s when there’s mysteriously dozens of comments just magically showing up that are contrary to the vastly popular opinion on only one contentious issue, that serve the best interests of an entity with the time, resources to try to sway public opinion through fake grassroots posting. Also that entity has a fragile ego and a long history of online manipulation…oh and also coincidentally they are all coming from the same server
Lots of suspicious comments in this thread. Seems like political astro-turfing has already arrived on Lemmy
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
Yes and yes.
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
It’s a shame this thread has gotten so off topic in places. It’s been cool reading and talking to lemm.ee users here (mostly). Despite lots of comments about Hexbear ‘brigading’ we’re just a big instance with lots of very active users, plus we don’t have downvotes (on Hexbear or here) so people tend to post instead of just downvoting if they disagree. While there’s been some Hexbear posts that have been overly agressive for my taste I also understand it because there’sbeen a lot of pretty serious abuse (from a minority) aimed at Hexbear users in the thread which has gone almost completely unremarked upon, which is sad, and doesn’t help make the thread an easy place for the majority of lemm.ee users to share their opinions.
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
You came into the comment of one Hexbear meme, called everyone “Nazi Scum” and left.
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
We weren’t asked to. If we had been, we have specific instance rule not to do so. And plenty of users, including me, have been doing their best to keep this thread on topic despite a lot of hate, lies, and abuse thrown at Hexbear users. Because we like lots of the people here, want to explore more, and are we supposed to be a community and engage with each other or not?
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
I know what you’re talking about and you’ve misread the context to mean nothing happened at all and no one died, but I’m trying to help keep this thread on topic for the benefits of the mods and lemm.ee users. So if you want a clarification go there and ask, debate it, or feel free to start a new post with a good faith request for what we think.
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
I’m not trying to argue with you (and here wouldn’t be the place to get into it) but that characterisation is false and I stated such for the benefit of other readers, try and change your mind.
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
That has been a nice addition recently.
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
“Tianenmen Square was a wholesale fabrication by the west”
No one on Hexbear claims that and if they did they’d be thoroughly ridiculed for it. I was active in that thread, the spread of opinion was pretty wide, but no one advocates anything close to what you posted above.
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
I feel a little sorry for the Lemm.ee users here that came to make measured, personal posts specific to the annoucement. There’s a fair amount of long off-topic arguements happening in bits of the thread now and that probably makes it harder to read and manage.
This is something that’s often been pointed to as a pure result of Hexbear users or federation with Hexbear and given rise to accusations of ‘brigading here and in the past’. While I don’t think every segue into debate has been useful here, and have also told comrades that I didn’t think this was the place for specific comments (which they removed) I also think there’s some important context to point out - and I hope it helps lemm.ee users wondering about all this traffic not to fall into the trap of assuming the worst based on a couple of comments:
- Hexbear is a very big and very active instance. A very small proportion of users posting in a thread (especially one explicitly about them) can seem like a lot to a lot of instances.
- Hexbear doesn’t have downvotes and Hexbear users do not have the ability to downvote posts or comments on other instances. This creates a culture where if people disagree, they tend to reply, not downvote instead. Another reason we’re very active.
Finally - and I say this fully acknowledging and appriciating the many ordinary, good faith, pleasant lemme.ee commenters that I’ve enjoyed reading and talking too even when I totally disagreed with them - a lot of these off-topic arguements and more heated comments do not come from nowhere. While not at all the majority, I do see a pretty shocking amount of actively hostile, hateful, and insulting behaviour here. Sadly, quite a bit of it would be banned under Hexbear’s moderation policy against things like slurs and hate speech too.
So try to keep in mind if you see salty Hexbear users replying to people that just in reading through this thread myself I’ve the following instances of abuse or smears against my comrades (and they continue popping up), so I absolutely support them defending themselves (as long as they stay within the rules here):
- Dimissal as the pejorative “tankie” - 4 times
- Users stating that Hexbear users are propagandists - 8 times
- Stating that people from Hexbear are specifically paid Russian/Chinese bots/propagandists - 10 times
- Direct equivalences of Hexbear posters to Nazis or just straight up calling us Nazis/fascists - 7 times
- Insults regarding mental health or IQ that would be classed as ablism on Hexbear - 8 times
- Dismissing users as children - 2 times
- Claiming Hexbear users are using vote-manipulation (impossible, as explained above) - 4 times
- Accusations of deliberate brigading rather than just commenting, being active - 11 times
I’ve tried not to count repeated instances from the same users. But sadly that’s not all. Just a handful of the following are comments that have been made against Hexbear users in this thread, without any kind of equal hostility. As far as I can tell they all still remain:
- “You guys are like cancer”
- “Braindead fucking tankies”
- “Get fucked”
- “Asshole” (multiple)
- That our beliefs are "moralistic bullshut"
- That some of our beliefs are "a criminal ideology"
- A comment that simply states "No Russians"
- That we’re “evil” (multiple times)
- An elaborate comparison to us “vandalising a Jewish graveyard” and other Nazi equivalences
- And of course a comment that explictly minimised the Nazi death toll with glee, seeming to imply they should have killed more. On the subject of disagreeing with equating the hammer and sickle to the swastika (hidden with spoiler tag, for those who don’t want to see it repeated)…
spoiler
“you are right, it is nor really fair to nazis, who killed measly 17 million people, compared to impressive 100 million killed by communists.”
There’s also been numerious instances of users misgendering Hexbear users. I’m not going to put all of these down to malice, but at Hexbear we display our pronouns for a reason - we love our trans comrades! You don’t have to, but could you please at least respect them and not misgender them?
Again, this isn’t the majority, but it’s honestly disappointing and worth keeping in mind amongst some of the louder, minority yells of ‘brigading’ etc.
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
This thread is the top post on Hexbear when sorting by Hot and All (rather than local). Our own threads in that position regularly get hundreds, sometimes over 1000, comments. The fact that a small handful of Hexbear users offering (mostly) very restrained, respectful comments is frequently referred to as “bridgading” demonstrates how frequently the vague accusations leveled at our (and other) instance(s) are made in bad faith as a mere reflex.
- Comment on Hexbear federation megathread 1 year ago:
As a Hexbear user and one of the people your mod & OP interacted with in that thread, I find much of this post concerning and often spurious.
First, personally, I am one of the people who accused him of engaging in behaviour that was tantamount to Holocaust denial. I did so after his repeated, blunt, assertions of false equivalency between the undisputed horrors of Nazi Germany and those - some true, many disputed, some outright refuted - of the Soviet Union. I explained that this practice is known as the ‘Double Genocide Theory’ and even linked to articles by Jewish historians and Holocaust academics that explained the issues with the theory and the history of its official use to whitewash far-right movements, particularly in post-Soviet states. Instead of receiving a modicum of serious engagement he instead deliberately and grossly misrepresented and dismissed not only my point but the work of the Jewish academics I linked before leaving with an insult.
Secondly, what exactly constitutes Kremlin propaganda? This is a usually completely baseless claim that is thrown constantly at Hexbear uses, but also almost any marginally left or anti-war figure on the internet. A small but vocal group of cynical users that cannot and will not tolerate opposing viewpoints use it to shut down debate and to smear people.
Your very own mod/OP engaged in a version of that in the thread on Hexbear and when pushed on what it meant variably either ignored the question or cast the net as wide as anything Russia (state, politicians, or media) have ever said. Several people made the point that a Russian source can say can say something that’s factual, or identify something true and use that as part of a political narrative. Does that objective truth suddenly because false as soon as it’s spoken by Russian lips? These questions were ignored.