Why would China engage in military conflict with the USA when they can just sit back and watch the USA collapse on its own?
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Maggoty@lemmy.world 2 months agoChina isn’t blameless. Factory and camp narratives aside, their naval actions are bellicose.
HomerianSymphony@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Maggoty@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Because a good solid shove can always make a collapse happen earlier.
UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world 2 months ago
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The atrocities that western nations have had to commit to keep a foothold in places like Osaka, the Philippines, Indonesia, Pakistan, and India really disqualify any of these folks from claiming another country is “bellicose”. We’re still out in Oceania committing genocides of native peoples, to this day.
That’s before you get into some belly-aching about a Chinese warship sailing through the Straight of Taiwan, as though its not American property.
Maggoty@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Hahaha. First of all this is old, there’s not any bases in Afghanistan anymore. Second, this is the same propaganda Russia runs with about NATO. They do belligerent stuff and then complain when their neighbors ask the country with a bigger stick for protection. Also, did someone include HK in this graphic? I know there’s lots of US bases in the Pacific, but I think someone is gilding the lily.
But also no, it’s not just about sailing a ship through Taiwanese waters. We do the same thing to China all the time, just to remind them that under international law that’s okay.
It’s conducting war games that completely surround Taiwan.
It’s claiming a ridiculous area for it’s EEZ, far larger than international law allows and completely disregarding any potential EEZ for other countries in the area.
It’s sinking fishing vessels in international water
It’s hacking the government systems of it’s neighbors
The list goes on…
UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world 2 months ago
There actually are several NATO installations still in and around Kabul to secure the international airport and the US Embassy.
The US also conducts war games across the South China Sea, including between China and Japan and through the Chinese territorial waters in and around the Korean peninsula. These have become tit-for-tat exercises, and would stop if the US was no longer in the region.
Glances at the US base map Yes. Ridiculous.
Show your work. When did China conduct a military operation to sink a fishing vessel?
I’m sure they’ll quit right after the NSA does.
Maggoty@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Buddy. There are no more NATO forces in Afghanistan. The Embassy was evacuated. Bagram was evacuated. Years ago now.
And why is China punishing Taiwan for American war games? They have plenty of ocean to use. And are you now claiming Jeju Island for China?
Our bases are not an Exclusionary Economic Zone. The Nine Dashed Line is indefensible.
Oh, now I need to prove stuff after you show up with a gilded lily of a meme masquerading as a map?
And I don’t dispute that the CIA hacks governments. I also don’t pretend it’s going to make them our friend or blame those countries for seeking protection from the CIA.
SSJMarx@lemm.ee 2 months ago
This is not a one sided provocation. We do war games with South Korea and Japan every year where we pretend to invade China and North Korea.
The waters that China (both the PRC and ROC btw) claims were promised to them under an international treaty that predates the League of Nations China never agreed to cede those waters, other countries started sailing in them during the Chinese Civil War when neither side could enforce their claim, and the modern UN’s position is that China lost their claim through lack of enforcement.
You mean the one fishing vessel that sank in an accident? The Chinese crew was grossly negligent, sure, but you make it sound the PLAN is sailing around shooting at fisherman.
We all do that. I agree it’s bad but there would need to be a mutual stand down agreement.
Maggoty@lemmy.world 2 months ago
We do not pretend to invade China. There is no plan to invade a country of a billion people with a Normandy style landing across the entire ocean. That’s a ridiculous claim. And as for planning to fight NK, you think maybe their constant nuclear threats against the US West Coast have anything to do with that?
South Korea has been an ally for 70 years, we aren’t just going to leave them. Trying to make defending allies and aggressively going after the vessels of other countries in an insane claim of an economic zone equivalent is just ridiculous.
According to China, the claims predate modern civilization entirely. That doesn’t make them true or consistent with international law.
It wouldn’t matter if it was just one vessel, but no it’s not. And the Chinese Coast Guard didn’t play it off as an accident. They said the Vietnamese fisherman had refused to leave the area China was claiming. For more fuckery let’s look at them stealing military supplies from the Philippine Navy.
Like I said above, the list goes on. And if all we ever do is conduct a war game to remind NK they aren’t shit we could never be as aggressive as China.
pop@lemmy.ml 2 months ago
wow what an attitude. everything will get old, so you’re fine with your sides atrocities cuz they’re “old” but it’s just not acceptable with others. Hahaha, suddenly a saint of peace, eh?
It more seems like you’ll be fine by no matter what your side does, and will have deflections lined up with propaganda but are gonna have a meltdown when it’s the other side doing what you fuckers do without consequences.
Attitude like yours is why there’ll never be peace.
Maggoty@lemmy.world 2 months ago
No it’s also wrong. The US has never had a base in Hong Kong. And most of the bases in the area pre-date China’s rise to being a regional power, much less their modern stance.
This is just straight up main character syndrome in national form.
Also we aren’t out there sinking or seizing Chinese vessels and threatening invasions. Our entire stance is, “leave our allies alone”.
But leave it to someone from .ml to ride in and try to twist the truth in China’s favor.