On the oil you are forgetting the externality it too poses. The oil needs to be disposed of. In addition to the externalities of the logistics of gas (gas stations, fuel deliveries, leaking Underground storage). There is a lot of these in the fuel process, from drilling oil all the way through the process.
Comment on White House threatens to veto anti-EV bill just passed by US House
ColeSloth@discuss.tchncs.de 9 months agoCount all the maintenance you would be spending on an ICE over that same time period. Oil changes, spark plugs, coolant. Brakes also have less wear on EVs due to regen braking. It’s too the point where they may last the life of the vehicle.
I love this.
Plugs are once every 100,000 miles well call it three times in 15 years.
EVs have coolant and it also needs replaced (lol)
Brakes do need changed less. Maybe 2 times over 15 years as opposed to 4 times. Like spark plugs, brakes are cheap. You know what isn’t cheap? The $2,500 inverter that makes the regen work on your ev. Better hope that doesn’t go out. Oops, that $2,500 isn’t including labor. Maybe you can do it yourself.
You got me on oil. Over 15 years there’d be 30 or 40 oil changes. Somewhere around $1,200 total.
Now be sure to add the things in that go out more often on evs. Shocks, struts, tires, tie rods, ball joints…oh, and that insurance on EVs is more expensive. The insurance alone more than offsets the $1,200 for oil changes. Then with tires costing about $700 a set to have mounted I’d sure hate having to do that 15% more often. And that rubber pollution is bad stuff. I just read an article last year about how badly it was harming fish. Ah well. Fuck em, right?
Tosti@feddit.nl 9 months ago
ColeSloth@discuss.tchncs.de 9 months ago
Motor oil doesn’t get disposed of. It just gets recycled, for the most part.
Tosti@feddit.nl 9 months ago
Good point, just read some more on that. Seems like the bulk is refined to be used in boiler furnaces and burned. A small part is reused, and then the final leftovers are so horrible they are disposed of in controversial ways.
But I must admit I thought it was all just burned outright. I have not been able to find numbers on what percentage is recycled and burned and what part is just burned, calling it recycling which is technically correct (the best kind of correct) but not what most people think of when they hear recycling.
frezik@midwest.social 9 months ago
The heat levels of that coolant is far less than in an ICE. It rarely needs replacing. Occasional topping up. A lot of EV maintenance schedules never bother with it.
progressive.com/…/car-insurance-electric-vehicles…
“However, it’s important to note that, while electric vehicles are currently far from the cheapest cars to insure — as they become more commonplace, and the availability of parts and qualified repair shops grows — the cost to fix them should go down, as should electric car insurance rates”
Again, nothing that can’t be solved in time.
Compared to the pollution output of an ICE? Really? You found one thing that polluted more and ran with it without considering anything else or how it would be solved.
ColeSloth@discuss.tchncs.de 9 months ago
In the future, evs will have better batteries, which has been my entire point. This is now, and now, evs are more expensive to insure.
You don’t replace coolant because it stops cooling or looses it’s ability to not freeze. It lubricates less effectively and can slowly start to pick up electrical currents over long periods of time. So you still need to change it. If you want to have that one over an ice vehicle though, then I guess “oh noooo. I have to spend $25 every 7 years and replace my radiator fluid”
Tires are less about pollution to me and more about the cost, but either way, you only brought it up because you wanted to complain about me pointing it out, and it being true, and how dare I bring up something true? Whatever, man. You think you’re part of this big thing to help the environment, but really you’re just naive and jumping on a bandwagon that’s forcing something before it’s actually going to be beneficial. Most every ev built today is going to be a net loss on the environment. We need clean energy first, then battery tech for EV’s (this may be just a few years away if a couple different auto manufacturers aren’t blowing smoke about their solid state batteries) and we need a charging infrastructure.
RubberElectrons@lemmy.world 9 months ago
No, cole, that is horseshit and you know it. Coolant contamination is a result of extremes in temperature, same with oil breakdown. Stop spreading misinformation and pretending to be an engineer.
People don’t have to buy an EV, it is their option. It has much lower TCO, and your point about “better hope the inverter doesn’t go out…”, makes me wonder if you know what exactly goes wrong with them by way of anguish knowing how they work.
At any stage in history, the introduction of a new technology tends to be initially inefficient. Time resolves this kind of thing, see the much more energy efficient processor in the phone you spout drivel from vs an older model. Same lithium polymer batteries, not necessarily the same capacity, but much more advanced switching and software techniques to make the energy go much farther.
Get educated before you go sucking off the oil industry under the hilariously thin guise of “EVs aren’t ready yet!”.
ColeSloth@discuss.tchncs.de 9 months ago
There you go. You keep talking about things being cheaper “in the future”. Well you don’t live in the future, buddy. EVs have been here for over a decade and they’ve only gotten more expensive to replace batteries in. Not less, and unlike many other bits of tech, this has a finite and predictable lifespan that is too short and too expensive for something that currently does too little to help the environment. The government forcing their sale right now is a dumb move.