Comment on ZFS: Should I use NAS or Enterprise/Datacenter SSDs?
yote_zip@pawb.social 11 months ago
ZFS doesn’t eat your SSD endurance. If anything it is the best option since you can enable ZSTD compression for smaller reads/writes and reads will often come from the RAM-based ARC cache instead of your SSDs. ZFS is also practically allergic to rewriting data that already exists in the pool, so once something is written it should never cost a write again - especially if you’re using OpenZFS 2.2 or above which has reflinking.
My guess is you were reading about SLOG devices, which do need heavier endurance as they replicate every write coming into your HDD array (every synchronous write, anyway). SLOG devices are only useful in HDD pools, and even then they’re not a must-have.
IMO just throw in whatever is cheapest or has your desired performance. Modern SSD write endurance is way better than it used to be and even if you somehow use it all up after a decade, the money you save by buying a cheaper one will pay for the replacement.
I would also recommend using ZFS or BTRFS on the data drive, even without redundancy. These filesystems store checksums of all data so you know if anything has bitrot when you scrub it. XFS/Ext4/etc store your data but they have no idea if it’s still good or not.
Pete90@feddit.de 11 months ago
Thank you so much for this explanation. I am just a beginner, so those horror stories did scare me a bit. I also read, that you can fine tune ZFS to prevent write amplification so I’ll read into that subject a bit more.
I thought ZFS without redundancy did give no benefits, but I most have gotten that wrong. Thanks again!
yote_zip@pawb.social 11 months ago
ZFS without redundancy is not great in the sense that redundancy is ideal in all scenarios, but it’s still a modern filesystem with a lot of good features, just like BTRFS. The main problem will be that it can detect data corruption but not heal it automatically. Transparent compression, snapshotting, data checksums, copy-on-write (power loss resiliency), and reflinking are modern features of both ZFS/BTRFS, and BTRFS additionally offers offline-deduplication, meaning you can deduplicate any data block that exists twice in your pool without incurring the massive resources that ZFS deduplication requires. ZFS is the more mature of the two, and I would use that if you’ve already got ZFS tooling set up on your machine.
Note that the TrueNAS forums spread a lot of FUD about ZFS, but ZFS without redundancy is ok. I would take anything alarmist from there with a grain of salt. BTRFS and ZFS both store 2 copies of all metadata by default, so bitrot will be auto-healed on a filesystem level when it’s read or scrubbed.
Pete90@feddit.de 11 months ago
I barely scratched the surface with ZFS, so I’m not going to touch another file system for a while now. I’m fine with detecting data corruption only, since those files (on the static data storage) can be replaced easily and hold no real value for me. All other data will be either on the redundant pool or is saved to several other media and even one off-site copy.
I already wrote down
ashift=12in my notes for when I set it up.In general, I found there is a lot of FUD out there when it comes to data security. One I liked a lot was ECC RAM being mandatory for ZFS. Then one of the creators of it basically said: "Nah, it’s not needed more than for any other file system’.
yote_zip@pawb.social 11 months ago
Yeah ECC RAM is great in general but there’s nothing about ZFS that likes ECC more than any other thing you do on your computer. You are not totally safe from bit flips unless every machine in the transaction has ECC RAM. Your workstation could flip a bit on a file as it’s sending it to your ZFS pool, and your ECC’d ZFS pool will hold that bit flip as gospel.
lemmyvore@feddit.nl 11 months ago
Where can I read more about good ZFS settings for a filesystem on a new RAID6 array? I don’t want to manage disks or volumes with ZFS, I’ll be doing that with mdadm, just want ZFS as filesystem instead of ext4. I assume a ZFS filesystem can grow if the space available expands later?
yote_zip@pawb.social 11 months ago
ZFS can grow if it has extra space on the disk. The obvious answer is that you should really be using RAIDZ2 instead if you are going with ZFS, but I assume you don’t like the inflexibility of RAIDZ resizing. RAIDZ expansion is fully ready to be implemented into OpenZFS, but it will probably take a year or so to actually land in the next release. RAIDZ2 could still be an option if you aren’t planning on growing before it lands. I don’t have much experience with mdadm, but my guess is that with mdadm+ZFS, features like self-healing won’t work because ZFS isn’t aware of the RAID at a low-level. I would expect it to be slightly janky in a lot of ways compared to RAIDZ, and if you still want to try it you may become the foremost expert on the combination.