Comment on The Not-So-Great Replacement Theory

• FabioTheNewOrder@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  So there’s two cultures one that embodies everything you don’t like and one that embodies everything you do like. Convenient. Maybe you should have led with that obtuse distinction.

  Unfortunately it’s not that easy. I do not like all cultures and I don’t hate all “cultures”. Cardi B is music, but it’s really not my jam, superhero movies are a form of cinema, but I don’t really dig them. In the same way there are cultural aspects of different heritages I do enjoy (the Italian food culture or the chinese family unity for example).

  What I was discussing it’s the underlying nature of these two concepts: culture creates bridges, “culture” create walls. You can enjoy a piece of art coming from a different society but it’s gonna be a real problem should you confront your beliefs with those coming from a different society than yours.

  what were you trying to say with the whole Chinese will never be European and Indians will never be German?

  I was saying that, until humans won’t see their cultural differences as simple joke material, there won’t be a simple way to have a pacific coexistence between different groups of people living in the same region. If we all continue to live our “cultures” as something sacred and untouchable we won’t be able to tear down the walls dividing us all.

  Are you aware of the history of state sponsored schools designed to erase cultural identity like you praise? It’s a pretty disgusting path you are skipping down.

  Not everything is up to the state, society can and must evolve on its own if we want to improve our lives on this tiny planet. I, for one, am doing what I can to demolish the idea that the "Italian heritage, is something that needs to survive at all costs precisely as it is today by challenging the most idiot aspects of this “culture”. No state intervention required

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  • magnusrufus@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Really walking back on that culture is fucking evil and has never done anything good stance eh? So we have established that your protip was garbage because culture has plenty of positive aspects, you just want to switch between definitions when it suits you.

    “I was saying that, until humans won’t see their cultural differences as simple joke material, there won’t be a simple way to have a pacific coexistence between different groups of people living in the same region” If that is honestly what you were saying you failed utterly to convey that. Instead you said a bunch of weird things about how foreigners can’t change and refuse to integrate.

    “Not everything is up to the state” thats not the point. The point is that states have in the past done exactly what you are praising. Taking children away from their families to strip all elements of culture away from them so they could integrate into “civilized” society. Deny them their language, their history. Anything that makes them different, beat it out of them. Literally.

    You sound exactly like xenophobe bigots. Those foreigners don’t fit in. They are different and that is bad, they should be more like us. Conform! Though they will never really belong here.

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    • FabioTheNewOrder@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Really walking back on that culture is fucking evil and has never done anything good stance eh?

      Absolutely not, I’m giving you a better definition of what “culture” means to me through your questions, that’s how a discussion goes usually. My stance about the majority of aspects related to “culture” being bad for mankind is the same from the beginning of this conversation.

      Not everything is up to the state" thats not the point. The point is that states have in the past done exactly what you are praising. Taking children away from their families to strip all elements of culture away from them so they could integrate into “civilized” society.

      Ok, let’s follow your logic and eliminate social services then. What right has the state to determine how a parent or a tutor should educate his child?

      You do understand that there are objectively harmful"cultural aspects " that we want to eliminate for the common good?? Mafia is a plague in Italy (and in the world nowadays) and I’d be more than happy if the Italian state would require mafiosi to lose their paternal rights and would help their children find a place in a more civilized family. We would have less mafiosi in a very short time.

      Until the 60es in Sicily, Italy, was legal for a man to murder his wife and her lover should he had found them having a sexual intercourse. The state had to issue a law to end this practice because society (even Sicilian women) was unable to abandon this farce of a misogynistic culture. Was this a wrong decision?

      In the same way I don’t want Chinese people living in Italy and, at the same time, continuing being enslaved by their compatriots as they were in China. I don’t want families living their life according to the most extreme interpretation of shari’a. There are plenty of antisocial norms disguised as culture, is it really that hard to say that we do not want them in our society??

      You sound exactly like xenophobe bigots. Those foreigners don’t fit in. They are different and that is bad, they should be more like us. Conform! Though they will never really belong here.

      I’m not talking about any race or culture in particular, I’m not a xenophobe, if you want to classify me you can call me a customs hater. I hate doing things a certain way “because we have always did it like that”, without any supporting evidence about the outcome of your actions. Give me a proof about the results of your method and I can consider its benefits towards the common good

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      • magnusrufus@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        Oh absolutely yes. You went from your protip of culture has been for the betterment of society to oh sure plenty of times it has been but thats a different type of culture.

        “Ok, let’s follow your logic and eliminate social services then” Not at all what I said. I think you are unaware of the topic that I am talking about. I am not talking about public schools in general. Nor am I talking about social services as a whole, a pretty big leap on your part there. Here is an example of what I am talking about

        “Give me a proof about the results of your method and I can consider its benefits towards the common good” what method are you talking about? What are you strawmaning here? Because I didn’t advocate any method.

        You seem to think that because a culture can contain any negative elements that suddenly all cultures everywhere are bad. Cultures collectively are way too big and diverse for that reductive view. A single culture is too big and diverse for that view. A culture will contain countless elements and individuals within that culture will adopt and practice those elements to various degrees and get this, some of them can even revise or reject elements of that culture. Culture isn’t static. Getting rid of culture is nonsense because whatever is left after you purge the elements you don’t like is still a culture.

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