Comment on A Universal Basic Income Is Being Considered by Canada's Government
wombatula@lemm.ee 11 months agoBut that is literally the definition of UBI, that’s what the Universal part is, if there is means testing it’s just welfare, and that would significantly raise the cost and lessen the impact.
Oversight costs money, every dollar that’s being spent on bureaucracy and every layer of bureaucracy that gets between the people and the income costs money and prevents people that need it from accessing it. That’s the point of UBI, and some “rich people” getting money is better than “poor people” or people on the edge of being poor being refused or given a lesser amount because we are paying for an entire agency to decide who gets it. That’s the biggest failure of welfare, have you ever tried to access EI? It’s a total clusterfuck and mostly serves to stop people that actually need it from accessing it in a timely fashion. The one time I tried to access EI, I literally got evicted and ended up on the streets, found a new job, and had moved into my new house before they ever gave me a penny… because of means testing.
I feel like you have a very weird take on this if your first thought is that they are “advocating for giving rich people money” when they are just pointing out basic facts.
Bonehead@kbin.social 11 months ago
Complaining about the costs of means testing is just an excuse to give money to everyone regardless of their situation. Rich people don't need more money. We can base this on tax returns and anyone that didn't make enough money is qualified. It can really be that simple, if we want it to be.
Seriously, just let poor people have some security. Let's just allow this to start, and maybe you can have some money later on. Right now, let's focus on the people that really need help.
wombatula@lemm.ee 11 months ago
No, it is not an excuse to give money to everyone, it’s a literal fact.
Basing it on tax returns costs money, paying someone to approve or deny claims costs money, paying for a system that checks tax returns costs money, figuring out what exact amount of money constitutes “poor” costs money, EVERYTHING COSTS MONEY. Do you not understand how much money bureaucracy costs?
Your only concern here is keeping money away from rich people, and you are ignoring basic facts and making things up to obscure that. I am not a fan of rich people myself, but you are literally twisting the truth to justify not letting rich people get money and it’s really quite silly.
Bonehead@kbin.social 11 months ago
Again, we can make it work any way we want. It doesn't have to be difficult. There doesn't need to be a lot of bureaucracy. We can just give poor people money. That's it. Just give poor people money. It shouldn't be this difficult. It shouldn't require giving everyone money just because a few poor people were given money. We can really make it work if we truly want to. But it'll never work as long as people want to make sure everyone gets money. Not everyone needs money.
All this talk about the cost of bureaucracy is simply a distraction. Just give poor people money...
wombatula@lemm.ee 11 months ago
Ok so you say it’s not difficult, please enlighten me and explain the system you would use.
Please, you’re the expert here apparently, detail the simple system without bureaucracy that you would use to give ONLY poor people money.