Comment on Online age-verification tools spread across U.S. for child safety, but adults are being surveilled
Kraiden@piefed.social 20 hours agoverification necessarily ties your device to your personal identity
needs to be an identifier associated with every device/account
I think you’ve misunderstood. Neither of these statements is true
If there were any possibility that a state actor had interest in identifying my personal identity of this account, and there was a record that pointed to my name, SSN, or other unique personal identifiers
That’s the whole point. This isn’t possible. There are NO identifiers ANYWHERE that link your account to your real world credentials.
if it’s being verified by a state authority at all
It’s not. At least not in the way you’re thinking. You are issued a file, like you are issued an id. This could be done from any device anywhere, and could theoretically be copied and moved around to other devices. This file is cryptographically SIGNED by the state.
Meta then send you a request with their own cert.
The third party then generates a 3rd cert that JUST verifies that you are of age, and contains NO other PII. It uses a combination of signatures from the request and your credentials file to generate this.
The result is that Meta can verify that this new cert was generated in response to their request, that it was based off of an authentic state credentials file, and that the user is of age. That’s it. Not the exact date of birth, no names, addressses, ssns or anything. JUST “user is >16.” There are no identifiers, and no way to tie it back to you IRL.
The state get absolutely no indication that any of this has gone down at all. The 3rd cert is verified off of a universal public key
anarchiddy@lemmy.dbzer0.com 18 hours ago
A state issuing a cert file has to be able to verify that it goes to the intended person. The state would have to know the ID of the person they’re issuing it to, otherwise it wouldn’t function as intended. Similar to blockchain wallets - they are anonymous all the way up to the point of fiat exchange, where most state actors can still end up ID’ing wallet owners.
Even if you try obscuring that information via encryption, it still gets signed by a ‘trusted’ authority at the end of the chain.
Even in theory this is a shit idea.
Kraiden@piefed.social 18 hours ago
Yes you need to prove yourself to the issuer, but that’s no different to proving yourself to the dmv to get a driver’s license. But this is the START of the process, not the end.
Once that process is done, like with a drivers license, the issuer gets no further information on what you do with it.
A SECONDARY cert that contains no PII is what Meta get sent.
Even if Meta sent that cert to the state, the ONLY information they could get from it is that it was state issued, and that it was issued to someone over 16.
The point isn’t to obscure the information, it’s to not send it in the first place.
There is no relation to the blockchain. There is no “chain” here to trace back. This is just an extension on regular old school cryptography. The only provable link is that the parent cert was generated by an authority. There is no way to tell if a 3rd cert was generated with your parent cert or mine
anarchiddy@lemmy.dbzer0.com 17 hours ago
I dont see how the second cert that goes to the site is useful if it isnt still associated with the first, but I also wouldnt trust the state to abide by an untraceable standard to begin with because identifying individuals by their accounts is in their interest.
I get where the enthusiasm for cryptography is coming from, but I think it’s misplaced.
Kraiden@piefed.social 16 hours ago
Oh 100% I do not trust the current govt. to do this properly! Like I’ve said elsewhere today, I just want people to know that it IS possible, and the idea that you HAVE to give up privacy to keep kids safe online is a false dilemma.
As for the second certs usefulness, it’s got enough information in it to prove that the parent cert was issued by a trusted issuer. It’s like a stamp of approval. A really bad analogy is if I take an official birth certificate, and cut it up in such a way that the official seal and the year are still connected by a thread of paper. You can tell that it was an official document issued to someone born in 1990 for example, but nothing else. Again, that’s a really bad analogy because it’s not a new cert, and contains the birth year, so it’s not the same.
This is all based on something called Zero Knowledge Proofs, that I don’t even pretend to completely understand, but it’s a whole field of study, meant to solve exactly this kind of problem. Currently watching this myself