Comment on My Thoughts on the Fosstodon Drama | Kev Quirk

• rglullis@communick.news ⁨1⁩ ⁨day⁩ ago

  Hey, any comparison to Ayn Rand or their fans should be an immediate ban. No need to go that low.

  All I’ve been arguing with you could be summed up as “if we want the Fediverse to be universal, we will need to grow a lot faster and we need to accept the reality that not everyone values the same things as you do” and you responding “No, I don’t to make the Fediverse universal because most people are too morally weak to stand for the things I care about”.

  (And if you think I am exagerating: don’t make me look for the conversation where you said that people should be okay using this crap because the other open source alternatives committed the grave sin of “raising money from investors”.)

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  • poVoq@slrpnk.net ⁨1⁩ ⁨day⁩ ago

    Fine I didn’t need to go as low as Ayn Rand.

    But I think you still didn’t get my argument last time. Tl;dr: there is no point in doing what you propose as it just results in recreating the same shit we already have. This has nothing to do with moral failings and everything with strategy and not repeating the same mistakes all over again.

    And besides that I agree that Siskin isn’t great, and most likely suggested this instead. And that “open-source alternative” are now open-core and can’t pay their bloated expenses now that VC funding has run dry. I hope you see the irony in what you just wrote, because that is really a clear example of how unsustainable and ill advised that kind of growth is.

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    • rglullis@communick.news ⁨1⁩ ⁨day⁩ ago

      it just results in recreating the same shit we already have

      This is you your passing opinion as undisputed truth. I am not proposing “Let’s take on the big corporations by building another big corporation”, I am saying “we can get rid of the dominance from big corporations if we help foment an economy of independent business.” and I am saying “if we keep this anti-business culture where we are hostile to even some food truck owner trying to connect to their customers, then don’t complain when the food truck owner continues using Facebook/Instagram/Twitter”.

      And that “open-source alternative” is now open-core

      Synapse is still AGPLv3. Their closed parts are for Enterprise.

      and most likely suggested this (Monal) instead.

      Monal does not make video calls!

      because that is really a clear example of how unsustainable and ill advised that kind of growth is.

      Is it? Because so far I managed to talk with a lot more people on Matrix than I ever did on XMPP, and that wouldn’t change even if Element closed shop tomorrow. And even if it did, the odds would be highly in favor of some other company like Beeper picking up the pieces to serve its customers and it would still be in their interest to keep things open to have the ecosystem around.

      So, at the end of the day, yes, I’d rather have this “unsustainable” growth than claiming any moral victory for sticking to the Betamax of chat protocols. This “unsustainable” system gave me and few hundred million people something that is far from perfect, but at least it can make video calls.

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      • poVoq@slrpnk.net ⁨23⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

        Lets not repeat the entire argument, but you are being extremely naive and literally play lipservice to what Mark Zuckerberg thinks the Fediverse should become.

        And, no. Vital parts for running a somewhat decently sized Synapse instance are not AGPLv3 licenced, Element requires a CLA so they can easily alter the deal even further, and their own marketing people go around fearmongering about the AGPL, which is a classic play of open-core companies. If it walks like a duck and all that…

        And Matrix had never even close to a few hundred million users. By their own admission during the presentation at the last FOSDEM, their MAU is barely above 300k. That’s what IRC had before Matrix started canibalizing them 🙄

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