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This is good to know. Our org doesn’t have multiple engineers, so I don’t think that the multiple levels would really fit, but SDE (Software Development Engineer?) may be a good match. Probably not a senior since I only have experience on single-dev projects?

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Reader9@programming.dev ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
Although your current role wouldn’t seem very senior at a large organizational, “senior“ is a relative term and at this company it seems like you are the engineer with ownership responsibilities over the end-to-end software development of a production system. So it might still be reasonable to use a senior title if there are other benefits

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- MrLuemasG@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
  Definitely. My thinking is that it would make it harder for HR to undervalue the position and, if we ever do get to hire additional developers, they will be looking to me / whoever is already in my position, in a senior / junior type fashion - at least for a solid chunk of time.
  
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mspencer712@programming.dev ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
That’s right. I know I was thrown off by large projects earlier in my career. The more you learn the stronger you get at understanding and packaging/setting-aside larger and larger pieces of a project. Bigger projects stress this ability in new ways. I think I lost a job in 2016 because I couldn’t stretch my brain around something bigger, at a small business with maybe 14 devs.

This might be a bad way to communicate this, and I think I’m taking this in a weird direction, but: I’ll use the Mozilla project as an example of a large project, though I’ve never looked at its source.

Suppose you were in an interview, and due to the specifics you are expected to be fast and fluent with the same technologies used in the Mozilla project, though you’ve never looked at the source before. Given a machine with the source already checked out and open in an IDE, you have one hour to read through the source and familiarize yourself with it, so you can answer questions about how you would approach adding features or test coverage.

What I want to know is: how high does your heart rate go? Does it go up just a little, as expected for a high stakes situation? Or does it go up a lot, because you honestly have no idea how much another dev in your situation would be expected to accomplish, so you have no clue what “good enough” looks like?

This is a crappy example because no interviewer could ever actually use this metric. But I’d say if it goes up a lot, for the reason I gave, you might not be ready for senior. And by this metric, it might not ever be possible to grow to “senior” without working at a company with large multi-team projects. But I think that’s accurate.

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- ck_@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
  Don’t let yourself be put of by peoples expectations. Most Senior Engineers have no idea that “engineer” is in their job description and which would not accomplish anything if you’d take away their Stackoverflow and ChatGPT.
  
  Senior is a title that is generally measured either by an individuals ability to sit on a chair for a long enough time or by its ability to make friends with management. Skill or knowledge overall has little to do with it.
  
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- MrLuemasG@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
  I can definitely see what you mean, and I appreciate the detailed post!
  
  As for your scenario, I feel as though my heart rate would go up to a moderate amount, maybe less depending on the exact structure of the project.
  
  The reason I say that is because I’ve done similar things in the past. My wife also has a job as a junior developer (working from home as part of a smaller multi-dev team supporting a massive project), but her team is set up in a way that she can only get a few minutes a week with her senior since he is always busy with his own tasks. She was never given documentation or even a walkthrough to explain how their project is structured or how their database is structured (they said in the interview that they would do this, but in reality the senior has to spend all of his time on other projects or in meetings). There are times that she gets stuck on a task that she has been assigned because she doesn’t know where in the source code she needs to look and she can’t get a hold of her senior. She’ll ask me for advice (without looking at the code, it’s essentially a 20-questions type scenario of hypotheticals) and, even though it is a completely different programming language and I haven’t actually seen the code, I can figure out what it is that she is needing to do and help guide her to where she needs to go in her project. When she finally gets a chance to talk to her senior about it a few days later, he confirms that the steps she ended up taking were correct for their set up.
  
  For example, she once had to update the items in a drop down that she couldn’t find in the code in their project. She knew that the dropdown was being loaded on a specific page, but the items weren’t being populated in that same place. I assumed that this was likely using a stored procedure or a view on their database to pull the dropdown items. With that assumption, I was able to help her trace to where the data was being loaded in their data repository. That gave her the name of a stored procedure. She went and updated the stored procedure’s definition in their dev server and it corrected the dropdown. She later met with her senior and he confirmed that the dropdown (and many other features in the app like the dropdown) are pulling out of stored procedures so they don’t have to redeploy code to update things like that.
  
  Similarly, one of the projects I had to work on at my org is actually taking an MVC web application and an API web application that are written by one of their multi-dev teams that are provided by our ERP software provider that we can customize to meet our specific needs. I did have some documentation to go off of, but I was able to get that loaded in and making customizations that fit within their architectural style within a couple of hours when I first started it.
  
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