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Comment on Hexbear federation megathread

I’m firmly in the “tone it down” camp on Hexbear (especially on other instances) and I appreciate people’s patience and I’m glad that some people have gotten past our abrasiveness. I’m hoping things will quiet down and stabilize before we burn our bridges. I’m glad to hear that your experience with our mods was positive and that you’re focusing more on that, over the years I’ve come to trust our mods and I believe they’re committed to making this work.

As has already been mentioned and acknowledged, clarification on Kremlin propaganda would be appreciated. I agree with removing false information, but I’m of the belief that it’s important to understand the positions and perspective of every nation, especially those considered enemies, for the sake of peace. I do not trust any source from any state implicitly, but rather I believe in gathering information from a variety of sources and critically examining each. I grew up in a “post 9/11 world” and in that context, any attempt to understand the motivations or historical context behind that event, beyond “They hate us for our freedom,” was treated with suspicion, along with all sorts of lies about Muslims in general. Since then, I don’t go along with hating who I’m told to hate, at least until I feel I’ve investigated the matter fully, including hearing the stated positions of both sides. To that end, I think there is value in listening critically to state-affiliated sources, from every side.

I look forward to having productive discussions in the future.

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Civility@hexbear.net ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
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CaptainBuckleroy@lemm.ee ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

…I agree with removing false information, but I’m of the belief that it’s important to understand the positions and perspective of every nation, especially those considered enemies, for the sake of peace.

I see what you’re getting at with this paragraph and statement, but in the context of the original post I have to call it out and ask further questions.

First, is there any context I’m missing? The examples of Kremlin propaganda provided by OP seem pretty straightforward to me. Russia is attempting to paint outside groups as subhuman. Are you attempting to be an apologist for those statements, or are there posts/comments that were painted in too broad of a stroke as Kremlin propaganda?

Second, I am calling out the whataboutism in your post. Under the rules outlined for lemme.ee, and in this post, there is nothing that points to support of Western imperialism, support of nationalism for any other country, or bias against Muslims. I don’t see what the point is of bringing any of that up except to distract and attempt to steer the conversation away from the topic at hand.

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- Zuzak@hexbear.net ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
  :::spoiler Spoiler for off-topic
  
  Russia is attempting to paint outside groups as subhuman. Are you attempting to be an apologist for those statements?
  
  I don’t know which specific statements you’re referring to, but no, I don’t agree with painting anyone as subhuman.
  
  are there posts/comments that were painted in too broad of a stroke as Kremlin propaganda?
  
  I don’t know, because the post is unclear as to what constitutes Kremlin propaganda, which is why I asked for clarification.
  
  Second, I am calling out the whataboutism in your post.
  
  Explaining my motivations for seeking out information from multiple sources is not whataboutism. I believe that it’s worthwhile to understand the perspectives and mentalities of groups that I disagree with, and I presented the example of my experiences in a “post 9/11 world” to illustrate the dangers of equating “Seeking to understand the other side’s motivations” with “Agreeing with the other side.” 20 years ago, we could be having a very similar conversation but I’d be accused of being a terrorist sympathizer instead of a Russian propagandist. Understanding the historical context of the creation of the Taliban and their motivations does not mean that I agree with them any more than it does when I understand the same as Russia. But it’s easier to recognize that that’s true of past events, because it is no longer in the heat of the moment.
  
  I consider your accusation of whataboutism to be anti-intellectual. The study of history is vital to understanding the present. Writing off all historical comparisons or attempts to learn from the past is dangerous and not valid. How can we possibly avoid repeating the mistakes of the past if we can’t compare them to present events?
  
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