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Comment on Anon questions our energy sector

whyNotSquirrel@sh.itjust.works ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

If the demand goes up I have some doubt, also, mining for Lithium is far from being clean, and then batteries are becoming wastes, so I doubt you would replace nuclear power with this solution

I guess in some regions it could work, but you’re still depending on the weather

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ceiphas@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
you know that grid storage does not always mean “a huge battery”, you can also just pump water in a higher basin oder push carts up a hill and release the potential energy when you need it…

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- iii@mander.xyz ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
  Pumped storage is a thing yeah. But might just as well go full hydro, if you’re doing the engineering anyways.
  
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  - wolframhydroxide@sh.itjust.works ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
    I feel like we’re missing the part about “push carts up a hill”, which involves virtually no serious engineering difficulties aside from “which hill” and “let’s make sure the tracks run smoothly”. See: the ARES project in Nevada
    
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    iii@mander.xyz ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
    Yeah, that’s 50MW, storing power for 15 minutes, so 20MWh. (1).
    
    There’s also a similar company: gravicity.
    
    They’re a fun academic endeavour. But if gravity provides the potential, water beats them per dollar spend.
    
    So do regular batteries.
    
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Ooops@feddit.org ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
You don’t need lithium. That’s just the story told to have an argument why renewables are allegedly bad for the environment.

Lithium is fine for handhelds or cars (everywhere where you need the maximum energy density). Grid level storage however doesn’t care if the building you house the batteries weight 15% more. On the contrary there are a lot of other battery materials better suited because lithium batteries also come with a lot of drawback (heat and quicker degradation being the main ones here).

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- iii@mander.xyz ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
  That’s through, density doesn’t matter much when it comes to grid scale.
  
  What battery technologies are you thinking of? Zinc-ion? Flow batteries?
  
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Jesus_666@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
They’re currently bringing sodium batteries to market (as in “the first vendor is selling them right now”). They’re bulky but fairly robust IIRC and they don’t need lithium.

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- scholar@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
  If you’re thinking of the portable battery marketed as ‘solid state’ then that was a scam - a teardown revealed it was just lithium cells
  
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  - Jesus_666@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
    Nah, I’m thinking of sodium-ion batteries. That’s 1990s tech and is currently in use for grid storage. Several manufacturers are currently bringing car-ready Na-ion batteries to market and there seems to be one production car using them in China (a version of the JMEV EV3, which I hav enever heard about before).
    
    Now, Na-ion is still less mature than Li-ion and that Chinese car gets about 17% less range compared do the Li-ion version.
    
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bassomitron@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
Yeah, lithium mining and processing is extremely toxic and destructive to the environment. On one hand, it’s primarily limited to a smaller area, but on the other hand, is it sustainable long-term unless a highly efficient lithium recycling technology emerges?

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